Golf lessons.

[wantobegolfer]

Hi everyone. I see on Kevin Haimes web site that he is offering a 2day golf clinic/lessons and would be interrested in taking that up. Im a mid hadicaper (18-20). As anyone taken lessons with Kevin's school beit this format or individual lessons? Is it worth spending the money? Whats your take on this? You can also email : wantobegolfer@hotmail.com
Thanks for your help.

Wantobegolfer.

[muskie]

Hi everyone. I see on Kevin Haimes web site that he is offering a 2day golf clinic/lessons and would be interrested in taking that up. Im a mid hadicaper (18-20). As anyone taken lessons with Kevin's school beit this format or individual lessons? Is it worth spending the money? Whats your take on this?

Thanks for your help.

Wantobegolfer.

There are all kinds of Teachers & all kinds of swing methods to be had out there . But if you are interested in learning HOW TO PLAY the GAME instead of PLAY SWING . Go see the Pro at Island Greens Driving Range , Al Harvey he get,s results and is reasonable in his rates . I believe there are one or two in this group taking lessons from him now . Good Luck . Muskie

[powerlefty]

I have taken a clinic from Kevin. He teaches a very mechanical style. If you can tolerate his attitude and don't mind a really mechanical approach, you will learn something from him. If you don't have thick skin, you may be offended early in the clinic.

[chipandput]

I agree that Kevin Haime's got an attitude, and it's not what you want in golf lessons.......chip

[chipandput]

There are all kinds of Teachers & all kinds of swing methods to be had out there . But if you are interested in learning HOW TO PLAY the GAME instead of PLAY SWING . Go see the Pro at Island Greens Driving Range , Al Harvey he get,s results and is reasonable in his rates . I believe there are one or two in this group taking lessons from him now . Good Luck . Muskie

Where is Island greens? Maybe I would be interest in taking some lessons with Al Harvey.Thanks!

[Andru]

Where is Island greens? Maybe I would be interest in taking some lessons with Al Harvey.Thanks!

Also try Bob Farant at The Marshes. Sounds like the same style as Al Harvey, feel golf.

[nice_lag]

Now please hold on. Kevin Haime centre is about more than one individual. He's not the ONLY teacher there. There are others and I've had my ups and downs there. My first contact with their teaching staff was with a younger guy Greg (forgot his last name). Excellent approach and very friendly. He taught me the basics and I appreciated every lesson. Then I needed one tweak one day and a second teacher messed around with my grip so bad that I couldn't play for the longest time. I forgot the name of the guy for a reason... very bad.

It took me another few sessions this winter to get it all back and, as interesting as it sounds, to get back to the grip I had used before.

All that to say that everyone has a different style and don't diss out an entire place because of one guy.

[Adska]

Although I have not personally taken a lesson from Kevin, I have routinely received lessons from Gregg Foley. Gregg, and all of the Pros are all incredible instructors.

I am a three year member at the Facility, and from my experiences, you couldn't find a better practice center anywhere in the city.

Kevin is a phenomenal teacher and person. The arrogance and abrasiveness must have been reciprocal, if that is actually the case.

Sure, many of the teachers take a mechanical approach to the full swing. What most people don't understand, is that you cannot learn the golf swing in one lesson. The ideas that are presented need to be practiced and grooved before a difference will be noticed.

I believe that the 'feel' approach is really only effective when teaching the short game.

[Andru]

nice_lag
I agree Gregg's pretty good if you're after a more mechanical approach. He knows his stuff.

Adska

The Marshes would rival Kevins Hamies practice facility. Any day of the week.

Feel golf IS a great option for those who are not interested in swing plane and mechanics. There's more than one way to learn golf. Don't mistake feel golf with going out there and whacking away. The feel comes from learning how to use the clubhead vs. body and swing positions. AKA Jim Flick vs. David Leadbetter. Both excellent teachers. Different methods.

[powerlefty]

Although I have not personally taken a lesson from Kevin, I have routinely received lessons from Gregg Foley. Gregg, and all of the Pros are all incredible instructors.

I am a three year member at the Facility, and from my experiences, you couldn't find a better practice center anywhere in the city.

Kevin is a phenomenal teacher and person. The arrogance and abrasiveness must have been reciprocal, if that is actually the case.

Sure, many of the teachers take a mechanical approach to the full swing. What most people don't understand, is that you cannot learn the golf swing in one lesson. The ideas that are presented need to be practiced and grooved before a difference will be noticed.

I believe that the 'feel' approach is really only effective when teaching the short game.

I was a member of Kevin's facility for 8 seasons. I agree it is an excellent facility. I have taken lessons from other staff there as well. In fact I first took a lesson from Dave Kalil there and have subsequently followed him to other facilities for annual tuneups.

My specific reference was to Kevin Haime and his style, not to the facility or other teachers. I can assure you the "The arrogance and abrasiveness" was not reciprocal, it was transmitted by Kevin to a group of a dozen or so people at a short game clinic. Lisa Haime on the other hand is quite customer friendly, recognizes returning members by name and engages in discussion. Kevin has never once gone out of his way to recognize me as a member of several years standing even though I was at the range almost daily, took lessons annually, attended a clubmaking and a short game clinic; and purchased a number of clubs as well as shoes and balls from his shop at the old site on Maple Grove Rd before he contracted it out to others.

As for the facility, I would say it is about the equal of Stonebridge and The Marshes in terms of quality.

He has substantial knowledge of the swing and the game, just be prepared to hear how great he is a few times during the lesson.

[muskie]

Where is Island greens? Maybe I would be interest in taking some lessons with Al Harvey.Thanks!

Island Greens Driving Range is Located at KartersKorner Family Center 6336 Fallowfield Road ( West of Barrhaven ) . Al Harvey runs his Golf Learning Center there in Conjuction with Island Greens as well as doing the Teaching for the Par-3 Thunderbird course off Carp Rd. Hope this helps . Muskie

[wantobegolfer]

Hi everyone. I see on Kevin Haimes web site that he is offering a 2day golf clinic/lessons and would be interrested in taking that up. Im a mid hadicaper (18-20). As anyone taken lessons with Kevin's school beit this format or individual lessons? Is it worth spending the money? Whats your take on this? You can also email : wantobegolfer@hotmail.com
Thanks for your help.

Wantobegolfer.

Thanks to everyone who took the time to reply. I suppose what I was originally asking is the format of the 2 day clinic and what it was all about. Most of you seem to be in sync about Kevin Haimes attitude. In conclusion, Kevin Haimes golf school is not wasted money but who you get as a teacher maybe a big dissapointment. I am sure there are good and bad teachers no matter where you go. Glad to see how franc your replies were. Not to many came to Kevins defense so I will conclude that interpersonality his not is strong point. I myself would have a hard time dealing with someone with this attitude.

Again, thank you.

wantobegolfer

[Rusty]

I just have to add my 2 cents.

I attended a short game clinic last year with Kevin.
If you can get over the ego he is a fine teacher, and the other fellow, (Austrailian I think) was great.

I love the centre, the short game area is great, I have always enjoyed practicing there. His wife and others are very friendly and helpful.

Alanis said it best with her "Ironic" song, "Its a fly in your chardonay".
Kevin is sort of like the fly, some people will say "I'm not drinking that wine, not with a fly in it." Some would pick the fly out and say "that sure is some nice wine, tastes a bit like fly though". And other would drink the wine, fly and all and say "I kinda liked the fly, it added another dimension to the whole experience.

Would I go back for more lessons, sure, I just won't drink the fly.

Rusty

I just had to say it!!

[BC MIST]

Hmmm.

It seems that a number of golfers have had a variety of experiences dealing with KH, many of them negative. If you don't like what he does, tell him, and then take your business elsewhere.

Kevin's swing method is difficult to learn and would require a lot of lessons and practice. Do you think that this is accidental? If he teaches the method that he uses, with a backswing that is too upright and a right elbow that is too far from the body at the top, then how can less athletically inclined golfers learn to hit the ball effectively?

A better approach would be found in John Dunnigan's "The Secret of the Golf Swing" (www.golfbetterproductions.com) Simple, on the proper plane backswing, easier to return to proper plane on the downswing, less "timing" required for a good shot. Bobby Farrant and a few others teach this method.

Just because a professionals name is all over the airwaves does not mean that they are necessarily good. Some are better at marketing themselves than others. Remember: "Teachers of the Year" are chosen by other teachers, not by their students.

[rancherJ]

Despite Kevin being a tad cynical during the two lessons I took with him three years ago I credit him with taking at least 2-4 shots off my handicap at that time just on his short game advice /mindset/techniques/instruction. I paid for and got results not a social time. (He may have become "too big" for Ottawa since.)

[w00dy]

Before coming on to OG.com i have never herd of Kevin, but from his actions on his radio show and from what i have herd from everyone here i would never go to his facility or get a lesson by him. Mainly because of his disrespect to other as seen in this thread http://www.ottawagolf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4015

I took lessons last year by Rick Boisvert and his 2 lessons took about 10 strokes off my game and to me made the game alot more fun. I highly recommend him to anyone looking to improve their swing or just need a touch up http://www.ottawagolf.com/rickboisvert/index.htm

[yun]

I finally got my first lesson and I can tell you I was more than happy with it. There's a pro over at Innes golfland that gave me lesson. Probably the first thing that I was looking for was affordablility since I'm a student, and he was very affordable. His name is Abdullah, and he used to teach over at capital. I've had a few tips from him before, but I never took the plunge for lessons until now (fighting a nasty push/hook). Anyways, depending on how many lessons you sign up for, it was about 30-35 bucks a lesson, but it lasted for alittle over an hour which is really good considering normally one would pay +40 bucks for a half hour session at alot of places. The session really gave me enough time to get a reallygood idea of what i had to work on, and what a good swing felt like. But the best thing was he didn't just fix my swing, but he really explained to me what I was doing wrong and how it effected what happens so that I could identify it right away if it occurred later. Anyways.. i thought I'd just add this into the convo since other names have been thrown in.

Yun

[BC MIST]

I've had a few tips from him before, but I never took the plunge for lessons until now (fighting a nasty push/hook).
Yun

This is because you broke my lie check board last week are you are being punished.

[Andru]

I have to give Cudos to Kevin Haime. I listened to his radio show over the weekend and I think he's coming around to the different golfers in the region.

He made a point of addressing his concerns with teaching and students. He can get you to an elite level for sure. But the student has to want the elite level. He spoke about this and I understood his side of the coaching issue. It was a good show.

It's like he reads our threads. Yeah I'd like to think we have that much influence. Anyway My point. I'm warming up to the guy. I do like his show very much.

The other point I wanted to make is this, good teachers have a way of creating an environment where people want to learn or practice. I recognize some are not going to practice no matter what, but those who are on the border. you can make things interesting for them. Being flexible in your approach to different students can have successful results.

[golfnut]

Hmmm.

It seems that a number of golfers have had a variety of experiences dealing with KH, many of them negative. If you don't like what he does, tell him, and then take your business elsewhere.

Kevin's swing method is difficult to learn and would require a lot of lessons and practice. Do you think that this is accidental? If he teaches the method that he uses, with a backswing that is too upright and a right elbow that is too far from the body at the top, then how can less athletically inclined golfers learn to hit the ball effectively?

A better approach would be found in John Dunnigan's "The Secret of the Golf Swing" (www.golfbetterproductions.com) Simple, on the proper plane backswing, easier to return to proper plane on the downswing, less "timing" required for a good shot. Bobby Farrant and a few others teach this method.

Just because a professionals name is all over the airwaves does not mean that they are necessarily good. Some are better at marketing themselves than others. Remember: "Teachers of the Year" are chosen by other teachers, not by their students.

Kevin teaches fundamentals - are the basic positions of golf difficult to learn? He teaches grip, stance, posture and the basic motion of the swing within a balanced position. I take lessons from him - so I have an idea of what he teaches. Your upright backswing and right elbow comments really take away from the credibility of your statements. Kevin teaches based on the person's body type etc. Point out one tour professional in the world who's elbow is not away from their body. Kevin teaches the "plane" for everyone based on body type - not strictly an upright position.

There are no secrets to the golf swing - as the book you refer to suggests. It is fundamental positions within the person's own feel and balance. There are so many books on the market - everyone has a theory. People are best to learn the fundamentals and work at it a bit.

Just one question for you. Most golfers don't know much about the golf swing. The guys I play with think they do - that's why they aren't very good. The averag male golfer's score is 97 - the average female's 114. If they don't know much about the game, do think it would be valuable for them to select the best instructor? That would be like the fans of hockey chosing the league MVP. The girls would all pick Wade Redden because he's "cute". Kevin was chosen as the top instructor in Canada because of his knowledge, approach and work to become a good instructor. I would say Golf Professionals know more than the average hacker.

Just offering some balance to your statement.

Cheers!!

[Andru]

Kevin teaches fundamentals - are the basic positions of golf difficult to learn? He teaches grip, stance, posture and the basic motion of the swing within a balanced position. I take lessons from him - so I have an idea of what he teaches. Your upright backswing and right elbow comments really take away from the credibility of your statements. Kevin teaches based on the person's body type etc. Point out one tour professional in the world who's elbow is not away from their body. Kevin teaches the "plane" for everyone based on body type - not strictly an upright position.

There are no secrets to the golf swing - as the book you refer to suggests. It is fundamental positions within the person's own feel and balance. There are so many books on the market - everyone has a theory. People are best to learn the fundamentals and work at it a bit.

Just one question for you. Most golfers don't know much about the golf swing. The guys I play with think they do - that's why they aren't very good. The averag male golfer's score is 97 - the average female's 114. If they don't know much about the game, do think it would be valuable for them to select the best instructor? That would be like the fans of hockey chosing the league MVP. The girls would all pick Wade Redden because he's "cute". Kevin was chosen as the top instructor in Canada because of his knowledge, approach and work to become a good instructor. I would say Golf Professionals know more than the average hacker.

Just offering some balance to your statement.

Cheers!!

I think the balance you're offering is good. I have to agree with BC_MIST here. I don't believe positions is the best way to teach people.

For ME, The focus is on what the club does and not what the body does. this accomplished more in a day than all the lessons I tok in a summer. I don't need someone telling me where to put my shoulder or to shift my weight. I do it naturally because I participated in athletics as a child. Hockey, Baseball tennis etc etc.

So to be really specific. I prefer being told. "You have the club doing this." "You need to get the club doing this." That's all I need. I know how to move my body. I don't need to be told that I'm turing my shoulders too quickly. Just say. Andru. The club shaft has a plane. It needs to be here. My body will adjust to get the club on plane then maximize the efficiency of the movement.

It gives a student a sense of skill development. Getting better at handling the tools in this case it's a golf club. Positional training. There's no feeling of skill development it's all mechanics.

Just one last thing. I agree once you get to an elite level and you want to refine your swing. Positions will help you become more efficient.

[golfnut]

Hi everyone. I see on Kevin Haimes web site that he is offering a 2day golf clinic/lessons and would be interrested in taking that up. Im a mid hadicaper (18-20). As anyone taken lessons with Kevin's school beit this format or individual lessons? Is it worth spending the money? Whats your take on this? You can also email : wantobegolfer@hotmail.com
Thanks for your help.

Wantobegolfer.

Hi wantobegolfer,

My experience with Kevin Haime's range has been very positive. I think some of the responses below is a question of personalities. I appreciate direct, no BS feedback - when I'm paying for a golf lesson - I don't want to be babysitted. Kevin's style may not fit everyone - but the facility has other personalities to meet the needs. This is part of the selection process of being a student. If you really want to improve - take the time and EFFORT to find someone right for you. For the posters below to do no research into Kevin or his style and then blame him for a less than positive experience is bush league.

As far as the quality of golf instruction at this place. If Kevin Haime was voted the best teacher in Canada by his peers - how can anyone suggest his methods are suspect? That's the way I made my evaluation for choosing him - he's a respected instructor. One guy below even suggested that an evaluation by peers is not as strong as evaluation by students. The peers are the one the know the industry and it's demands!!

Anyway - this Internet board is like most. There are undertones to certain opinions - and unfortunately you will never know what they are unless you talk to the person and find out their motivations.

some advice - if some people on this board don't like Kevin's approach - tell him - it's the only way he will get better and better serve you!!!!! That's the Canadian way - pay for something, act like you enjoy it at the time and then complain about it!!

I like the guy's golf show - he has an opinion which gets you thinking.

Have a great season and good luck.

[Andru]

Hi wantobegolfer,
My experience with Kevin Haime's range has been very positive. I think some of the responses below is a question of personalities. I appreciate direct, no BS feedback - when I'm paying for a golf lesson - I don't want to be babysitted. Kevin's style may not fit everyone - but the facility has other personalities to meet the needs. This is part of the selection process of being a student. If you really want to improve - take the time and EFFORT to find someone right for you. For the posters below to do no research into Kevin or his style and then blame him for a less than positive experience is bush league.

You know what's bush league. Coming into a discussion and backhanding other people's opinions. Fine there's a personality conflict betwwen KH and some of the people on this forum. That doesn't mean they want to have their hands held or be baby sat.

Anyway - this Internet board is like most. There are undertones to certain opinions - and unfortunately you will never know what they are unless you talk to the person and find out their motivations.

I'm glad you said this. I'll remember this when I read your post again.

Some asked about Lesons at Kevin haimes. and those who have had lessons responded. Just because it wasn't positive doesn't make them WRONG or UN-Canadian.

[golfnut]

You know what's bush league. Coming into a discussion and backhanding other people's opinions. Fine there's a personality conflict betwwen KH and some of the people on this forum. That doesn't mean they want to have their hands held or be baby sat.


I'm glad you said this. I'll remember this when I read your post again.

Some asked about Lesons at Kevin haimes. and those who have had lessons responded. Just because it wasn't positive doesn't make them WRONG or UN-Canadian.

Thanks for the reply.

I also gave my opinion and suggested others do some homework before they assault someone's personality on an Internet forum.

Like I said, if you don't like something someone does, have the stones to talk to them face to face - not attack their personality qualities on an Internet forum. In my opinion that is bush league (see quote from Benjamin Franklin).


"If you can't say something nice about someone, don't say anything" My Mother

[Andru]

Thanks for the reply.

I also gave my opinion and suggested others do some homework before they assault someone's personality on an Internet forum.

I'm not debating whether KH is a nice guy. I think I've stated on the record he's a good guy.

The first part I think is cool when you said "I also gave my opinion". That's what everyone is here to do.

I'm taking a little issue with The second part of the sentence. Anyone who doesn't agree with your opnion of KH has either

(A) not done their homework
or
(B) expecting way too much from him.

one or both might be true. Who knows. It's their opinion.

Like I said, if you don't like something someone does, have the stones to talk to them face to face - not attack their personality qualities on an Internet forum. In my opinion that is bush league (see quote from Benjamin Franklin).

"If you can't say something nice about someone, don't say anything" My Mother

I agree.

[Deep Woods]

That's the Canadian way - pay for something, act like you enjoy it at the time and then complain about it!!

lol...this is so true.

As for instructors, I agree with you : find one that suits your style and personality...not much point otherwise.

[Rusty]

I think that this all started from a members question on what we thought of his courses. I am not sure that he expected so many thoughts!

I am afraid in this politically correct era, telling someone that you are not happy with thier product directly is viewed as rude. Instead I think that what we do now is buy the product, use it and evaluate it, and if we like it we buy more. If we are not happy we go to another source of the product and try that one, until we find what we want.
I was not put off by Kevins attitude, but to go up to him and say that I enjoyed the course, but that I felt like he came accross as arogant and if he wanted me to come for another course he would have to work on being more humble, would not have been met with a postive response.

Hey he's human everyone has flaws - I talk too much, way too much - but we both carry on and I doubt that this little coffee clatch is going to put him out of bussiness.

Bottom line is that he is a character, just like Robin Williams, I love Robin, but I bet a lot of people here thing he's crap!
I would love to have a beer with Kevin, maybe thats a good contest for the Bear or Chez to run this summer.

Rusty
2 cents

[em69]

I am afraid in this politically correct era, telling someone that you are not happy with their product directly is viewed as rude.

Not really, many people appreciate constructive criticism. If you are selling a product, then it would be desireable to know how your market feels about it, or else how do you know how to change it.

[Deep Woods]

Not really, many people appreciate constructive criticism. If you are selling a product, then it would be desireable to know how your market feels about it, or else how do you know how to change it.

This is very true for a product/service. For a personality, I question it. We're talking years of habit. If someone came up to him, and said that, he'd either be: hurt, indifferent, accepting to change, or mad. 3 are useless responses.

Could he change how he deals with people? Probably not, unless he devoted his life to change. then he'd have old customers who would say "I don't feel as confident with my lessons without the confidence of Kevin Haimes".

Just my opinion.