How many points will Crosby score his rookie season?

[mberube]

How many points will Crosby score his rookie season?

[faldo]

Will be sent back to the Oceanic for seasoning....

[broken27]

Will be sent back to the Oceanic for seasoning....

LMFAO!!! Nice one!!! That'd crack me up for sure... Already have a bet that Ovechkin will score more goals...

Dan

[Golfbum]

Will be sent back to the Oceanic for seasoning....

I beg to differ with you on that comment. He will be on the bench and ice to sell tickets! Mario and Company need CASH

However it should be interesting to see how he makes out. I am sure some of you watched Brandon Prust and his checking line of the London Knights shut down Sydney and Company in the Memorial Cup Final. It will get even tighter in the NHL.

But then again with the redline gone maybe he can light it up.

[mberube]

LMFAO!!! Nice one!!! That'd crack me up for sure... Already have a bet that Ovechkin will score more goals...

Dan

He will never go back to junior hockey. That would be a waist of talent.

As for Ovechkin scoring more goals…maybe but more points…not a chance. Certainly not if Crosby plays with Mario and Marc on the first line.

Who is Ovechkin going to play with? Zubrus and Klepis???? my F$%? off!!!

[broken27]

He will never go back to junior hockey. That would be a waist of talent.

As for Ovechkin scoring more goals…maybe but more points…not a chance. Certainly not if Crosby plays with Mario and Marc on the first line.

Who is Ovechkin going to play with? Zubrus and Klepis???? my F$%? off!!!

And when Mario falls apart 14 games into the season, what happens to Crosby's point total?

Besides which, any pansy can get assists if they just play with good enough players. Get some goals if you want to impress me... You can't win a game on assists.

Many people forget that while Sid the Kid was playing junior hockey, Ovechkin was playing against men (including many NHLers last season) in the Russian Super League. I'd say he's far more ready to play at the top level than Sidney. Not to say either will necessarily outperform the other, but let's be honest here...

Dan
PS - I am also thoroughly aware that Crosby will not return to junior... Not that it'd be a waste of talent, but because the Penguins are trying to capitalize on him as early as possible.

[mberube]

My opinion on why he will not return at the Junior level is that he has accomplished everything possible and he would not learn anything significant. He would learn a lot more in the AHL or in Europe as Ovechkin did.

I also agree that Ovechkin is more ready for the NHL then Crosby. It certainly helped playing in the Russian elite league last year. The calibre was very high.

Both players were prolific goal scorers throughout there carers. The problem with Ovechkin is that when the going goes rough, the Russian get hiding. Did you watch the Junior gold medal final this year. Ovechkin was nowhere to be found.

Crosby can take the hits and still make an impact on the game.

Mario leaving after 14 games remains to be seen. The fact is that at the moment Marc and Mario are present. Nobody close to that talent can play with Ovechkin at the moment.

I would not be surprise not to say disappointed if WC don’t pick up somebody to play with Ovechkin but for the moment it looks better for Sid the Kid.

[mberube]

Besides which, any pansy can get assists if they just play with good enough players. Get some goals if you want to impress me... You can't win a game on assists.

That statement I don’t agree with. I played good hockey during my short hockey carer. I was a goal scorer. I never thought I was the talented player on the team although I got the credit. I my eyes the talented player was my left-winger that always found the way to find my blade at the right time. At that moment, it was easy to put the puck in the net. The real talented player finds a way to control the play, bring everybody to him and feed the open player at the right time.

A friend of mine, Christian Mate, played for the Colorado organisation. He was a great AHLer. He is a natural goal scorer. He also played in Europe a couple of years. He once told me that any one could score goals there eyes closed playing with Sakic or Forsberg on their line. They always seemed to put the puck on your stick at the right moment.

Sorry but you don’t score goals without assists.

[broken27]

Sorry but you don’t score goals without assists.

Clearly the most false statement in this thread. You can't get assists without scoring goals, but MANY goals are scored with NO ASSISTS.

My point is that for each goal scored, there can be one or two assists. A lot of the time, the guy picking up the secondary assist had little to do with why the goal went in. Watch a powerplay where they cycle around until someone shoots the puck and a rebound is tucked in. Why does the point man who passed it to the other point man who takes the shot get an assist? He is academic to the scoring play....

I played tons of hockey growing up and was always a set up man. I found that the better my linemates, the more points I'd get. I wouldn't score any more goals though.

Dan
PS - This is obviously all opinion aside from the fact you can get goals without assists. Neither player has set foot in the NHL yet, so making these predictions is relatively assinine. Ovechkin will always have a slight edge because he's played at a higher level than Crosby though, in my opinion.

[The Shtick]

I don't think that Crosby will get many points this year. He'll have nobody to pass it to him and he'll be covered like crazy!! Sorry boys, but Mario is done and Recchi won't be able to keep up. That's even IF the Pens can even keep a puck out of their own net!!

[mberube]

Clearly the most false statement in this thread. You can't get assists without scoring goals, but MANY goals are scored with NO ASSISTS.

My point is that for each goal scored, there can be one or two assists. A lot of the time, the guy picking up the secondary assist had little to do with why the goal went in. Watch a powerplay where they cycle around until someone shoots the puck and a rebound is tucked in. Why does the point man who passed it to the other point man who takes the shot get an assist? He is academic to the scoring play....

I played tons of hockey growing up and was always a set up man. I found that the better my linemates, the more points I'd get. I wouldn't score any more goals though.

Dan
PS - This is obviously all opinion aside from the fact you can get goals without assists. Neither player has set foot in the NHL yet, so making these predictions is relatively assinine. Ovechkin will always have a slight edge because he's played at a higher level than Crosby though, in my opinion.

My bad. I should have been more precise. I know that some goals are scored unassisted but the large majority are scored during a team effort. I can’t say for sure but I’ll through out a number, 80 to 90% of all goals are scored with an assist. An unassisted goal will impress me but I will not stamp a player as a great player because of an individual goal although most of the time very spectacular.

I understand your point that some if not most assists had nothing to do with the goal but I watched Sid play for the last two years, cause I follow the Q, and let me tell you that this kid hade an impact on almost all the goals he assisted on. I cant say the same for the Russian kid cause I did not see him play other then the junior championships the last two years.

If you look at this NHL web site, you will se that most players have more assists then goals in their carers.

http://www.nhlpa.com/WebStats/CareerStats.asp

[1972Apex]

I think it's time for Dan Kilbank to start up www.OttawaHockey.com
Should be a goldmine!

[broken27]

If you look at this NHL web site, you will se that most players have more assists then goals in their carers.

http://www.nhlpa.com/WebStats/CareerStats.asp

Doesn't that prove what I was saying? It's MUCH easier to get an assist than a goal. Most players (aside from Rick Nash who scored 41 goals and only had 16 assists) have roughly 1/4 goals and 3/4 assists.



Dan

[mberube]

Doesn't that prove what I was saying? It's MUCH easier to get an assist than a goal. Most players (aside from Rick Nash who scored 41 goals and only had 16 assists) have roughly 1/4 goals and 3/4 assists.



Dan

No, this proves that you can win games with assists.

Not all players are goal scorers but that doesn’t mean they are not great players.

[Golfbum]

No, this proves that you can win games with assists.

Not all players are goal scorers but that doesn’t mean they are not great players.

HUH? You win games by putting the puck in the net

I do agree that there are great players who do not score a lot of goals. but set them up. However you still need the player who took the pass to put it past the goalie or the other guy is not getting an assist is he?

Either way, I feel Crosby will do ok as an 18 year old rookie. Will be dominate like he did in JR? No he sure won't. As I said in another post, if you had watched the Memorial Cup Championship game in London you would have seen him shut down completely. Now if another JR team could shut him down then surely NHL players can. Mind you London had one hell of a team, but basically one line shut Crosby and his linemates down in that game.
Maybe Mario will put him on a line with Streaking Rico Fata!

[jonf]

Crosby will wipe the floor with Ovechkin in every offensive category. It doesn't matter if Lemieux does get injured, a great player will make all those around him better. He did it in junior, and Crosby will eventually do it in the NHL. He's not going to leap out to a 100 point season, but he will leave the Ovechkin in his dust, hiding his tears behind that stupid mirrored visor of his

[mberube]

HUH? You win games by putting the puck in the net

I do agree that there are great players who do not score a lot of goals. but set them up. However you still need the player who took the pass to put it past the goalie or the other guy is not getting an assist is he?

Either way, I feel Crosby will do ok as an 18 year old rookie. Will be dominate like he did in JR? No he sure won't. As I said in another post, if you had watched the Memorial Cup Championship game in London you would have seen him shut down completely. Now if another JR team could shut him down then surely NHL players can. Mind you London had one hell of a team, but basically one line shut Crosby and his linemates down in that game.
Maybe Mario will put him on a line with Streaking Rico Fata!

That was one game only. He still finished top scorer in the tournament and was shut down against the best team in the league on game 5. There are some week D’s in the NHL and there are also strong D’s. A good player knows what side to bring up the puck.

He will surly not dominate but I am intrigued.

And for the goal assist comment. My guess is that if you have 3 assists in a game I’m pretty there was at least 3 goals scored.

[broken27]

Crosby will wipe the floor with Ovechkin in every offensive category. It doesn't matter if Lemieux does get injured, a great player will make all those around him better. He did it in junior, and Crosby will eventually do it in the NHL. He's not going to leap out to a 100 point season, but he will leave the Ovechkin in his dust, hiding his tears behind that stupid mirrored visor of his

Sure thing bud... You clearly don't watch any hockey at all if you believe this. Wait to see how Crosby holds up to a hit from Scott Stevens (who they play a TON this season).... At least Ovechkin has played with men before...

We'll see...

Wish I could discuss it more, but I have to get back on the phones to track all the Free Agent signings....

Dan

[SGH]

Have to agree with Dan on this one. Ovechkin will win rookie of the year in my opnion, and I am interested to see how Crosby's body holds up over the course of a season. Don't get me wrong, as a Canadian, I want nothing but the best for Crosby, but I feel he has more to prove that Ovechnkin, and may have a harder time doing it. You have to respect Ovechkin's skill and speed.


That being said however, will Washington even have a team come October? As of this morning, they didn't even have enough players for one line, and I've heard nothing concerning any pick-ups. As TSN said, if you have your own stick and skates, give Washington a call, they're looking.

[mberube]

Have to agree with Dan on this one. Ovechkin will win rookie of the year in my opnion, and I am interested to see how Crosby's body holds up over the course of a season. Don't get me wrong, as a Canadian, I want nothing but the best for Crosby, but I feel he has more to prove that Ovechnkin, and may have a harder time doing it. You have to respect Ovechkin's skill and speed.


That being said however, will Washington even have a team come October? As of this morning, they didn't even have enough players for one line, and I've heard nothing concerning any pick-ups. As TSN said, if you have your own stick and skates, give Washington a call, they're looking.

As for what I have seen I think (in my opinion) that Crosby is stronger physically then Ovechkin. I compare Crosby and Forsberg in style of play. Both are very strong player, they can play with one hand on the stick and manipulate the player with the other. The other point is that he never gives up. When he is nailed to the boards, he will grind it out and try to grab the puck back. I have yet seen that from Ovechkin.

As for speed, both players are explosive but it is hard to say who is faster cause they have not played a lot against each other.

Rookie of the year? Hard to say but the Caps are already at 38 660 000$ in salaries with nobody to show for it. If Ovechkin wins rookie this year he will have earned it.

[jonf]

Sure thing bud... You clearly don't watch any hockey at all if you believe this. Wait to see how Crosby holds up to a hit from Scott Stevens (who they play a TON this season).... At least Ovechkin has played with men before...

Dan

Scott Stevens is wicked, but you only have to worry about him when you're cutting across the blueline with your head down...and like any great playmaker, crosby always has his head up (at least as far as I've seen)

As for Ovechkin...he may have played with men before, but its not as if the Russian Elite League is hard hitting. Russian players get to the NHL, and half of them have this indignant look on their face when they first get hit big, as if they had never even heard of a bodycheck before. A slight exaggeration of course, but you get the idea

[Ty Webb]

I have always found in the NHL that a great player (Lemieux, Jagr, etc) will get credited with an assist for just being on the ice when a goal is scored even if they didn't assist. Once saw a philly game where Lindros hopes the boards and skates to the net. A shot comes from the hash mark and hits the twine. He gets an assist?? Credit that to lazy officiating (he is good, he must have assisted)?

[powerlefty]

Pittsburg just signed Andre Roy. Could he be Crosby's Dave Semenko???



http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story.asp?id=132418

[broken27]

Scott Stevens is wicked, but you only have to worry about him when you're cutting across the blueline with your head down...and like any great playmaker, crosby always has his head up (at least as far as I've seen)

As for Ovechkin...he may have played with men before, but its not as if the Russian Elite League is hard hitting. Russian players get to the NHL, and half of them have this indignant look on their face when they first get hit big, as if they had never even heard of a bodycheck before. A slight exaggeration of course, but you get the idea

Stevens is a lethal hitter ANYWHERE on the ice. Sure, his bread and butter is at the railroad tracks, but realistically he's one of the hardest hitters in the NHL.

As for Russians not being hitters, I think you'll find that there is quite a bit of physicality in RSL hockey (Volchenkov came from there). There just isn't the stupid goonery we get here in North America. If I'm not mistaken (which I could be), a fighting major carries an automatic one-game suspension in Russia... Ovechkin is also bigger (by quite a bit) than Crosby, so I wouldn't worry about him too much... He's played 4 years of pro hockey... Crosby? ZERO.

Ovechkin: 6'2" / 212lbs
Crosby: 5'10" / 180lbs.

Sounds like Cindy is in for an arse-whooping to me...

Dan

[broken27]

I have always found in the NHL that a great player (Lemieux, Jagr, etc) will get credited with an assist for just being on the ice when a goal is scored even if they didn't assist. Once saw a philly game where Lindros hopes the boards and skates to the net. A shot comes from the hash mark and hits the twine. He gets an assist?? Credit that to lazy officiating (he is good, he must have assisted)?

Agreed, to an extent. I personally think they should do away with secondary assists completely. They mean nothing 90% of the time.

Of course, Jagr NEVER got credit for an assist he didn't earn....

Dan

[mberube]

Stevens is a lethal hitter ANYWHERE on the ice. Sure, his bread and butter is at the railroad tracks, but realistically he's one of the hardest hitters in the NHL.

As for Russians not being hitters, I think you'll find that there is quite a bit of physicality in RSL hockey (Volchenkov came from there). There just isn't the stupid goonery we get here in North America. If I'm not mistaken (which I could be), a fighting major carries an automatic one-game suspension in Russia... Ovechkin is also bigger (by quite a bit) than Crosby, so I wouldn't worry about him too much... He's played 4 years of pro hockey... Crosby? ZERO.

Ovechkin: 6'2" / 212lbs
Crosby: 5'10" / 180lbs.

Sounds like Cindy is in for an arse-whooping to me...

Dan

That’s what they said about St-Louis. He was never drafted cause he was too small and fragile. I can make a list of very small player that had great carers in the NHL. None of then had the talent Sid has.

I can also name big boys that hid on the bench when the big boys came to play, Yashin come to mind.

Time will tell.

Mike

[SGH]

Hard to say but the Caps are already at 38 660 000$ in salaries with nobody to show for it. If Ovechkin wins rookie this year he will have earned it.

I don't think the Caps are at the cap (no pun intended) already. They have Kolzig signed for four and a half, then three other players for under 1M each. I realize they are paying half of Jager's salary, but that's still only 3.75M (approx). All tolled, they have four players signed to contracts, and one compensation package, for a total of just under 12M dollars. They have room to recruit some help.

[mberube]

I don't think the Caps are at the cap (no pun intended) already. They have Kolzig signed for four and a half, then three other players for under 1M each. I realize they are paying half of Jager's salary, but that's still only 3.75M (approx). All tolled, they have four players signed to contracts, and one compensation package, for a total of just under 12M dollars. They have room to recruit some help.

Check this site dude:

http://www.rds.ca/retouraujeu2005/re...salaires1.html

It’s the French version of TNS but you will see every teams actual payroll.

Caps: $38 680 770

Mike

[SGH]

That's the rollback effect on the '03/'04 salaries, and has nothing to do with their current cap situation. For a better reference, consult

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/feature.asp?fid=6926

They have more room than any other team.

Check this site dude:

http://www.rds.ca/retouraujeu2005/re...salaires1.html

It’s the French version of TNS but you will see every teams actual payroll.

Caps: $38 680 770

Mike

[mberube]

That's the rollback effect on the '03/'04 salaries, and has nothing to do with their current cap situation. For a better reference, consult

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/feature.asp?fid=6926

They have more room than any other team.

Cool! My bad.