So , what's happening in Arnprior?

[golfisforfun]

Jvincent, is that a true statement? Are the operating costs at Arnprior really close to $1M?

I'd love to know which courses in the region bring in over $1M is revenues.

[jvincent]

I can't speak to Arnprior specifically, but I know that my course spends more than that and I've seen that number published in other places as well.

Arnprior might be lower, but not by a lot.

[golfisforfun]

Whic course are you at?
Doing some quick math, I can't see Arnprior bringing in any more that $600k in greens fees... But maybe I am wrong.

[jvincent]

I'm at Rideauview.

[headcase]

If they are spending $1 million a year to run the place it is easy to see how they ended up in this position. New owners that is business men will not spend that amount. I wonder how much of the budget each year went to debt payments?. Hopefully whoever buys the place will keep it as a golf course, not a housing development down the road.

[solstrum]

First. Yes 1 million a year.


Second. Sold. Robert Reid bought it.

[golfisforfun]

$1M is crazy... Like mentioned above, I sure hope that includes a lot of interest payments on the debt, in addition to paying off the debts.

[jvincent]

It adds up quickly.

- Property taxes
- Greens crew salaries
- Equipment costs/maintenance
- Utilities for the clubhouse, etc

[golfisforfun]

Fair enough but let's look at revenues from golf...

6 tee times per hour x 3 golfers per spot x 6 hours per day x 22 good golf days per month x 6 months x $45 per golfer

That's only $612k

I know I only based that on 6 hours straight of tee times per day with threesomes at every spot, but there's no way Arnprior has full tee sheets every day. And we all know our golf season is not 6 months of good golf.

I can see how it's tough to make a go of it when you have over $1M in costs!

[jvincent]

That's why they also rely on food and beverage sales, tournaments, etc. to make up the shortfall.

The golf course business is a tough.

[nice_lag]

Fair enough but let's look at revenues from golf...

6 tee times per hour x 3 golfers per spot x 6 hours per day x 22 good golf days per month x 6 months x $45 per golfer

That's only $612k

I know I only based that on 6 hours straight of tee times per day with threesomes at every spot, but there's no way Arnprior has full tee sheets every day. And we all know our golf season is not 6 months of good golf.

I can see how it's tough to make a go of it when you have over $1M in costs!

That is the "golf" part of the equation and as you have demonstrated, is not where a course makes money. Food and beverages, carts, trail fees, advertising also contribute to revenues. Unfortunately they are not directly linked (ie it's not because you have more traffic that you'll have a proportional increase in F&B revenues). Difficult business to be in.

[big mac]

I can't remember what thread I was in last year but I did the same type of calculation and I came in at 750,000 max for most of the middle of the road clubs. There is no use adding restaurant fee etc because it all boils down to the same thing in the end and about the same profit margin.

My question would be "how did Arnprior get into so big of a deficit ?" Surely there must have been questions asked when money was allocated for certain things. If they weren't then that could be the problem.

I se that Mr. Reid is a golfer and a businessman---I hope he keeps the course going and makes the proper decisions.

[Shivas Irons]

I se that Mr. Reid is a golfer and a businessman---I hope he keeps the course going and makes the proper decisions.

I was speaking to an acquaintance who was at a meeting Friday evening regarding the future of Sand Point and word is Mr Reed wants to keep the golf course as a golf course and has no plans to turn it into a subdivision.

[PalmerIsKing]

Lots of money in beer, and don't forget about carts.

[imozzie]

I was speaking to an acquaintance who was at a meeting Friday evening regarding the future of Sand Point and word is Mr Reed wants to keep the golf course as a golf course and has no plans to turn it into a subdivision.

That would be great...one can only hope!

[solstrum]

That would be great...one can only hope!

Mr. Reid had to present his plan and intent to the debenture holders.

It included keeping it a golf course.

It included upgrades to the clubhouse including deck/patio

[shortdrive]

Tentative opening date is April 29th

[Gofish2]

Here is a little more info on the purchase http://www.insideottawavalley.com/ne...y-golf-course/

[big mac]

The above was an interesting and positive read. You don't see too much real down home support for anything today. As mentioned in the article Mr Reid has no "golf" industry experience but he does have good business experience and it sounds like he also has some good experience that will work with him. I think that over the next few years you will see a loss of a few clubs but on the other hand you will also see the ones with good management skills will survive very nicely.

Congrats--thanks and all the best in the endeavor

[jbgolf67]

The golf course business is a tough business, but owners and managers need to be smart and creative. Sure there are green fees, membership, tournaments, F&B, and maybe some proshop and range revenue, but courses need to look beyond golf. Weddings, work functions, parties, and socials to drum up extra revenue. On the expense side, courses need to be smart and creative to save on costs. Look at what was done at Pinehurst #2 to drastically reduce water consumption and course maintenance. Now I'm not saying Arnprior is Pinehurst #2 and I know a large investment was invested into that project, but that is an example of a change/investment that can be made. Hard and fast isn't necessarily a bad thing.

[duuh]

The course was sold to local family. Will be open apr 28/15