Sims at GolfTown

[golfisforfun]

So I was at Golftown trying out the Callaway V Series 3 wood.

I do not have a very fast swing speed, but I did confirm that I can swing a 3 wood almost as fast as a driver. I assume that it has to do with shaft length, and for my swing, a 43.5" shaft gets me the fastes clubhead speed...

But my issue was the "smash factor" on the simulators.

I took 20 swing, some I hit well, some were a bit off, some where straight, some fades and even a few draws...

And each and EVERY one had the 1.36 smash factor. It was identical on every swing and there is no way I made the same contact on every one.

I am around a 4-5 handicap, and my swing speed wit the 3 wood ranged from 92 up to 100 when I really put a full swing on it. The most I could get was 230 yards total yardage and many were around 212, 215, 217 etc...

How much difference will the tape on the face make for ball speed or smash factor?

And how accurate are these machines if every swing gave me the exact same results for smash factor?

thanks

[Chieflongtee]

FWIW Tutelman wrote an article on smah factor recently:

http://www.tutelman.com/golf/clubs/Mike2.php

[John]

I hit 6 iron 215 in the sim. They definitely aren't very accurate.

[Swerve]

I find the one in gatineau particularly bad. I know my swing speed with the driver is between 102 and 105 but I would consistently get 115-120 there. The guy working there was trying to justify it: "o, you are really killing it" and "that was a good swing" I just laughed at him.

[downhillslider]

Anything on the face other than a spray on substance will affect the spin 's #'s thus affecting all other #'s

Like John says about the accuracy, I mush prefer the #;s I am getting with my flight scope S2.

In fact, I was hitting my newest 3w Monday, 42'' Wishon 929 and getting some awesome ball speed with 90 mph head speed resulting on average 220 carry/237 roll. This puppy has a high COR/ hot face !

A side note, These are indoor numbers. Results achieved with the flight scope set up outdoors will yield truer #'s

Welcome to the polar vortex !!

[jvincent]

I hit 6 iron 215 in the sim. They definitely aren't very accurate.

Girly. You should be able to get at least 230 on the sim. Start working out.

[Big Johnny69]

Girly. You should be able to get at least 230 on the sim. Start working out.

He must still be recovering from his back issues.

[headcase]

Guys, be careful with the stats from these sims. Your best bet is still outdoors at a Demo day at your club.

[golfisforfun]

I went back yesterday and did some work looking for a new hybrid to slide in after my 25* hybrid and not leave too big a gap...
Anyways, ball after ball was 1.36 smash factor and then suddenly it jumped to 1.45 and stayed there for the rest of the session.
We could not get anything other than 1.36 or 1.45 and that is a HUGE jump.
From what I have read, with the same swing speed, a jump of .9 smash factor could be close to 17 yards of carry !!!

So then I asked someone else to hit a few balls and it was the same, nothing other than 1.36 and 1.45...

Oh well... Now I know that my 25* hybrid goes 25 yards further than my 25* 5 iron, my 19* hybrid goes 10 yards more than my 15* 3 wood, and my 7 iron goes as far as my 5 iron... Should be a fun year! hahaha

[larry]

I have always found that I am a much better ball striker on those machines than in real life.

[Pine View]

The new High Definition Golf simulators we have installed at Pine View have a variety of features that track things like club impact position, club head speed, etc. You can look at all of these advanced features while you play or simply during a session on the virtual driving range.

[sebmour]

They use GC2 here in Montreal. They don't have those in the Ottawa area?

[MusicMan]

Girly. You should be able to get at least 230 on the sim. Start working out.

The kid must be slowing him down.

[HoganWoods]

I think the trainyards location uses GC2. The software they run, which is the foresight driving range, is boosted by default. Best thing to do is ask them to unplug the GC2 from the computer and read the numbers on the actual LCD screen of the device. The numbers that the hardware will display are accurate. It won't show you total, only carry, Launch Angle, Ballspeed, and spin numbers.

[golfisforfun]

I am shocked at how little the staff at GT know about the sims... Some of them really have no clue how they work or what the data really represents.

[downhillslider]

I am shocked at how little the staff at GT know about the sims... Some of them really have no clue how they work or what the data really represents.

Its been an extremely long winter so far and with it comes lots of time to ponder and reflect.

I'm sitting here reading your post and the more I read it, the more I struggle with, is this a serious comment or, are you trolling for a debate.

A retail store stays in business because they sell a whole lot of product, Show me a salesperson who cares more about making sure the customer get's the best possible product for their game rather than making a sale.

How can a sales clerk possibly be sufficiently qualified technically to adequately provide any relevant information for you to make a sound decision, especially with golf equipment.Trust me, it takes years to be even remotely proficient in the art fitting.

The majority of them are salespeople, not qualified experienced clubfitters.

The bottom line is all that matters in retail, and that includes all establishments, and I mean all establishments that sell golf clubs.

Beware, be wise and be properly informed when purchasing golf clubs.

[golfisforfun]

I work with hundred and hundreds of retailers across Canada and many of them are specialty shops where the sales people are very well educated about product and do make sure you get the best product for your needs and abilities.
I would expect 100% that the staff be educated on the basics of the Sims.
I am not expecting a pro club fitting experience. I am expecting an educated salesperson.

[downhillslider]

You nailed it with your reference to specialty shops. If they don't know what they are talking about and don't put the needs of the customer as a priority, they are out of business, simple as that.

Big box retail attract customers via their ability to offer a lower price point than competitors and eventually forcing them to become nothing more than a memory, Remember Chuck Brown's ?

Golf is unique and the golf consumer is a very unique animal. My observations over the years have led me to conclude that golfers seem to care more about the name that is on the club because the commercial said it is the best thing ever and they try and try to make the club work like it has been touted with no avail. And with that comes an inner attitude of stubbornness and defensiveness towards their equipment. It's like they are ashamed in someway. Notice how many used clubs are for sale ?

I remember when GT was opening in Kanata years ago and I enquired about a position. Their answer was " You are over qualified and we are only paying x amount for the position " That's all I needed to hear !

[sebmour]

I used to work at a big box store for photography and video equipment. I am a photographer by trade but when I moved to Montreal I wanted a little security income while I was building my market. I work for 2 years at a store called Lozeau. I always put the needs of my clients at the priority. No commission at the store either. I actually have clients that brought my to Hawaii to teach them about photography for 2 weeks because she wanted to purchase a 10K camera and I was explaining to her that for her needs, the 5K camera would be better. I took 3h to do the sale.

I have many clients that came back for my gear afterwards that only wanted to deal with me. They would wait sometimes an hour just to have me take care of them.

I still work the same way with my business. Clients need #1. If clients are not the type of clients I am looking for, even if they would hire me for 4-5K I will still turn them down and send them to someone I know it'll work with. Their quality experience is #1 for me.

Now Golf town is another story. Some many types of equipment, accessories and other gadgets. I personally don't fault them for not knowing all intricate details of the equipment since there's "new" equipment every month for them. Most buyers to some very intense research now before making a purchase. They come prepared with very precise questions about engineering, about design that no one can remember for all the manufacturers in the GT.

I also know that even I don't know everything detail about my tools or all of the types of photography.

People also have to be indulgent. Having worked in sales and service for over 10 years, I know from experience that some clients are just trying to discredit you or they try to show that they have more knowledge than you after reading on the product for 4-5 days in a row.

I also compare purchasing to taking golf lessons. Some people will go to their lessons and tell the PGA pro what drill they want to work on because they read on Golf digest or Golf WRX that this drill his awesome. Some will go with an open mind and let the PGA pro do his work, trust it and actually work on it. Some will go open minded but think that after a 30 minutes lesson they master what the PGA pro was asking them to try so that they can get better. Unfortunately, we all know that the game takes lots of time to get better at and master.

Sorry for the long post.

[EagleEagle]

I wrote foresight sports and ask them why their GC2 simulators have the constant smash factor.His reply:CG2 measure ball flight and does not measure club speed.The constant smash factor allows for a comparison of overal carry and always attributes the improved ball speed as a result of the different club speed.
in other words the smash factor Is set to default by design on gc2 simulators.
I hit a bunch of balls Friday night with my driver at golf town east and Saterday I played at the new simulators at Pineview.My best drives were 2 yards difference,both locations gave me the same distance.
I know at golf town they are constantly sending the full time staff to the different golf Comapanies head offices For training and certification and are well equipped to satisfy the needs of 99 percent of golfers.Golf town also offered fitting with many of the golf manufactures Company represenitives,you just need to ask at the front desk to find out when they will be coming.

[john8888]

EagleEagle is right. The GC2 is accurate for ball spped, launch, spin and carry. Smash factor requires an HMT. So ignore smash and total distance. The tape on the club is cutting down spin so you are allways getting flyer results. Allways compare one of your clubs with tape to the new one you are looking at.