New Decisions

[nokids]

While I am obviously in the minority here, I will continue to believe that the "integrity of the game is best served by" playing by the Rules of Golf, and the Rules of Golf permit the collection of evidence from all sources, which significantly increases the probability of "getting it right," which some feel is wrong.

To me, golf is entertainment. It's not heart surgery or a murder trial or putting a man on the moon where we must get it right or the person dies. Mistakes will be made by officials, players will miss a cut, lose a tournament, lose money, dreams will be broken, fans will go crazy online, and I will find it all very funny. Getting it right all the time? It's not wrong, it's just not as entertaining.
ok ill stop trolling : )

[BC MIST]

To me, golf is entertainment. It's not heart surgery or a murder trial or putting a man on the moon where we must get it right or the person dies. Mistakes will be made by officials, players will miss a cut, lose a tournament, lose money, dreams will be broken, fans will go crazy online, and I will find it all very funny. Getting it right all the time? It's not wrong, it's just not as entertaining.
ok ill stop trolling : )

[AAA]

New DMD flowchart

http://www.usga.org/uploadedFiles/US...wchartv1-3.pdf

[nokids]

New DMD flowchart

http://www.usga.org/uploadedFiles/US...wchartv1-3.pdf

A multi-functional device may still be used as a communication or reference tool (e.g., to make a phone call or access the Rules of Golf application)

Can I play Sudoku on my phone while I wait on the group ahead of me?

[stevek]

Note: Applies to all devices even if the additional information is not used or is disabled/switched off.

With my Leopold GX4i, if I leave the yellow faceplate that measures slope at home which in effect makes it a GX3i, does that make it a device that does not measure slope? Or is it still just a disabled slope measuring device? (I'm guessing the latter.)

But I think the flowchart is still ambiguous with regard to cell phones.

Is the distance measuring application capable of measuring conditions or providing information other than distance (e.g., wind speed, temperature or club recommendation)?

This comment should put all cell phone GPS into the illegal category as if you have GPS on your phone, you would also have Internet, which would allow access to weather conditions, which is in violation.

It doesn't much matter to me as I'm playing so poorly, I usually don't have a line of sight and have to rely on a SkyCaddie anyway. Which is why I have both.

[gbower]

Steve I'm not 100% on the Leopold but do know that it was not allowed and I think that any of the devices that do allow slope in any configuration are still not allowed. As far as the mobile devices that can access the weather there is a new decision that does allow them as the temperature and wind speed aren't from the exact location that the device is. Check the decision below.
---------------------------------------
14-3/18
Weather Information Accessed on Multi-Functional Device

Q.During a stipulated round, may a player access local weather information (e.g., wind, temperature, humidity) through an application or internet browser on a multi-functional device?

A.Yes. The prohibition in Rule 14-3 is only applicable to the specific act of gauging or measuring conditions that might affect a player's play (e.g., through use of an anemometer or a thermometer). When accessing weather reports provided by a weather station through an application or internet browser, the player is not actively measuring or gauging the conditions. (New)

[stevek]

Hi Gerry; Hope your offseaon is going well. Or are you in 'south' season?

I think the slope rule is silly anyway as all you need is a practice round and a pencil to know how many yards various hills take off your shot. Hole #11 and #12 (Premiere) are both 11-12 yards according to Leopold. Slightly more for the Gold area on 12 but I only have to play from there when some mean person puts the Blacks over there.

[gbower]

Hi Gerry; Hope your offseaon is going well. Or are you in 'south' season?

I think the slope rule is silly anyway as all you need is a practice round and a pencil to know how many yards various hills take off your shot. Hole #11 and #12 (Premiere) are both 11-12 yards according to Leopold. Slightly more for the Gold area on 12 but I only have to play from there when some mean person puts the Blacks over there.

I'm in "south" season. I agree with the issue on slope but if players have played a practice round for a tournament they will know the information. All pros have the info as the caddies use DMD's with slope most of the time for practice rounds. I know I am using my phone as a GPS and none of the other information on it is relevant to the exact location that I'm at.

[stevek]

I-Phone have apps called;

1- Clinometer + slope finder + bubblelevel.

2- Laser Level Slope Converter.

3- GPS

Between these apps you have the same potential of not following the rules as a Leopold GX4i with the silver face on and the yellow face in the case or in your bag.

[adanac]

I-Phone have apps called;

1- Clinometer + slope finder + bubblelevel.

2- Laser Level Slope Converter.

3- GPS

Between these apps you have the same potential of not following the rules as a Leopold GX4i with the silver face on and the yellow face in the case or in your bag.

Based on the flowchart, the decisions are different for dedicated devices and multi-functional devices. AFAIK, the Leupold is a dedicated device, and the flowchart directs you to the left side.

[AAA]

If the Leupold is competing with Nikon they will have a mode that includes a slope feature (as in Nikon 1000AS) which does not conform. Other models without the slope feature will conform.

Ironically we have been issued with the 1000AS for course rating but cannot use them in play.

[stevek]

"Is this device capable of measuring conditions or providing information other than distance (e.g., slope, wind, temperature or club recommendation"

In the flow chart I still don't see how the GX4i would be anything but a no to the above question if the yellow face is not on. (especially if the player/caddie don't have it on their persons.)

It would be just as easy (maybe easier) to cheat if the player was using a cell-phone illegally than for a player to put on and take off the bright yellow face of the slope reading chip/plug.

I sent an email to the usga for further clarification.

[AAA]

[I]
I sent an email to the usga for further clarification.

If you are in Canada they may not respond. You should try the RCGA or the R&A.

[LobWedge]

Hi Steve. I got clarification from RCGA about 2 years ago. The GX4i does not conform in either configuration.

[LobWedge]

Here's the text of our email exchange at the time...




Hi Brent,

Quick question. Is the Leupold GX-4 rangefinder legal for tournament play (LR permitting) if the Smart Key faceplate is removed? I've been trying to search for an answer. App.IV, 5 would lead me to believe that it isn't, but to me the water is kind of muddy on this one.

Thanks.


It is my understanding that the Leupold GX-4 calculates factors other than yardage (i.e. gradient, slope, etc.).

In a competition where the use of an artificial device is permitted – the device cannot measure anything other than yardage (even if those “other” functions are turned off or removed).

If my understanding of the unit is correct – they would not conform to Rule 14-3 (Artificial Devices, Unusual Equipment and Use of Unusual Equipment).

Brent McLaughlin


Thanks Brent. Just to make the waters a bit more murky though... I understand that the additional functions of the rangefinder are only accessible via a chip that is mounted in the removable faceplate, and not internally in the rangefinder itself. Sorry, I forgot to mention this in my original message. Not sure if this makes a difference or not.


Doesn’t change anything – if there’s an option for additional functions (whether the chip is removed or not) to be used – it does not conform.

Brent McLaughlin

[AAA]

From their website

USGA Legal Notice
The ability to legally use this product in USGA events is under appeal. At the present time it can not be used.

[LobWedge]

BTW - Leupold apparently has a new version, the GX-4i2, that has interchangeable faceplates and is USGA conforming. Not sure of all the details as to why this one is, and the GX-4i isn't. It's not listed on the Leupold site yet, but it's for sale on the GT site, and there's been discussion about it on GolfWRX.

I'm interested to see the differences.

[stevek]

BTW - Leupold apparently has a new version, the GX-4i2, that has interchangeable faceplates and is USGA conforming. Not sure of all the details as to why this one is, and the GX-4i isn't. It's not listed on the Leupold site yet, but it's for sale on the GT site, and there's been discussion about it on GolfWRX.

I'm interested to see the differences.

Here's the answer I got;


Dear Steve,

The Leupold GX-4i is considered a non-conforming distance-measuring device and is not permitted for play when the local rule permitting use of such devices is in effect. However, Leupold has modified their product and released the GX-4i², which is permissible under the local rule. The operation of the GX-4i² is such that the software necessary to activate the hardware on the device is housed in the dongle located in the face plate. This is identical to the loading of a software application onto a mobile device that utlizes existing hardware on the device to perform a non-conforming function. The software and hardware resided on the device of the original model - the GX-4i.

With respect to the level, the player could use the app to check the level of the table where he is sitting and not be in breach of the Rules of Golf. However, if the player were to use the level app to gauge the slope of the green, the player would be in breach of Rule 14-3. The GX-4i slope feature is a golf specific feature that resides on the device and provides a calculation of effective distance, which is not permitted.

Thanks for your inquiry.

J. Carter Rich
Director, Equipment Rules and Conformance


The underlined second part of the answer was in response to my statement that a smart phone with a level app could be used to determine slope and yet is still allowed to be used where the GX4i is not.

Hopefully Leopold has a trade-in program for their product or I'll have to switch to Bushnell.