Up in arms

[mmlincon]

Thought I'd chime in here....

tman you are in a place where we all have been. The bottom line is you will have to compromise. There is no perfect system right now. For what you want the AboutGolf system is probably your best bet - that's usually the case with expensive stuff. I've played on one quite a bit and it is very accurate but not perfect 100% of the time. I really don't have details on prices because they are so out of this world.

Next up would be the GC2, mainly because you want something you can take down quickly. You should seriously consider the GC2 and I'm basing that on reviews from this site primarily. I have never used one but am considering buying a used one to test it out myself. I will forever be a skeptic on their spin measurements until I use it myself. (why is nobody in the industry able to record spin without markings -except them? ) I have a huge problem with their markup on courses though. They are making huge profits on these courses that were developed by end users for the most part and they receive no royalties. There is something wrong with that. That being said I'd keep it on your list.

If you can deal with a permanent setup I'd look at ProTee. For a shadow based system it's the best around. They've added cameras to increase accuracy of ball data so you get the best of both worlds. ( club and ball ) You get a huge library of courses and new ones are included - can't beat that!

OK, GGS(GSA). You're a DIY'er? You better be. In fact you better think of yourself as R&D. I've had GGS systems for about 7 years now. For me it was fun to move to the latest new product and mess around with it. The big problem was it was more money for this and more money for that and half the time the crap didn't work as advertised. It feels half-assed. You've basically got one guy doing everything and nothing every gets completed. It's whatever his whim is for the month. Bottom line if you're looking for a hobby go with GGS. If you want a simulator look elsewhere for now at least.

Another thing to consider is what level of golfer you are or the people who will be playing on the system. Some of these systems are less accurate with lower level players. The AboutGolf system will overly reduce the clubhead speed on a fat shot, for example, making the shot more penalizing then it should've been. Each one has its weaknesses.

So, you can put your arms down now and compromise like the rest of us.

[bubba22]

mm this is as good a piece of advice as I have seen.

[GolfMonster2]

I also got the impression from one retailer that because I was spending relatively big money on my setup, I should give the whole job to them. It was either "get me to do the whole thing for you or don't dare ask me for any advice". That was even after I'd released a whole bucket of cash for the launch monitor. Point being, don't be surprised by these attitudes and shop around and don't be scared to do it yourself.

I know a guy who spent $100K on his sim and it isn't as good as mine (which cost 50).

[tman]

Tman.
Before you consider GSA further read this thread from start to finish
http://forum.OttawaGolf.com/showthre...747#post491747

Thanks a lot for the heads up on this. I cam sometimes be a sucker for price. Lol. But this is something I really want to work and work good. What way does a guy go? A lot of high praise for the GC2 it seems. Just have to get over the floor mount and marking the clubs. Anyone know of or have a system that is not on the floor and you don't have to mark the clubs for club data?

[CPA]

As we are discussing in another thread the option of saving 7k on HMT but getting Swingbyte2 at $150 as an add on for GC2 base unit.

[tman]

As we are discussing in another thread the option of saving 7k on HMT but getting Swingbyte2 at $150 as an add on for GC2 base unit.

I guess the ease of use would be the reason I want something that is built into the room as a system. I really cant get over though the price of these systems. you can buy a lot of big ticket stuff that you would think would be more expensive then a few cameras and some software.

[tman]

Does anyone have any experience with bogolf or have the system?

[bubba22]

You do know that Cory couldn't get the Bogolf system up and running. From what I know, Bogolf works the exact same as Sportscoach. Beware!!!!!

[tman]

Got a chance to talk to Cory today and we are suppose to hook up or chat tomorrow. I see a lot of similarities in sport coach and bogolf except for the golf courses and the upgraded graphics. Tonight I am just having a hard time justifying the price of these things. Heart transplant or golf sim. Lol. Same price.

[bubba22]

Good. Hopefully you will get some options. Remember, nothing is perfect.

[tman]

One would think it should be for the money. We are not talking about a few thousand dollars. It's like 15000.00 dollars. Not chump change to me. Sorry. Again confused why these things are so out there in price. Are theses cameras really that much to build? Is the software that much more than ever program and game in all of staples? Just flustered. Thanks for listening if I am rattling on.

[bubba22]

tman the original simulators were all 40-50 grand years ago. The prices have actually come down but I do agree that they are still high. You seem fixed on cameras however sensor, optical and radar are other good options. In fact the Trackman folks will debate their Doppler technology is better than cameras. Remember not all cameras are the same. True high speed sim cams that actually measure ball spin are probably really only used in About golf and HD golf. GC2 uses flash to capture ball pics for spin measurent from dimples. You can debate spin from dimples vs an actual ball marking. All others measure speed, direction and azimuth and estimate spin. Fact is the cameras are not THAT expensive but the technology, R n D, marketing and software integration allows them to jack up the prices.

[tman]

I can't thank you enough for spending the time responding. I'll see what good stuff Cory has to say and figure something out I guess. Just have worked so hard saving and building the room for this. Just want it done to enjoy I guess. You live only once I keep telling myself.

[bubba22]

No probs. good luck. Your in good hands with Cory.

[HSR]

Golfmonster - it is probably in a thread somewhere, but could you repeat what set up you are currently using?

[bubba22]

Here is the thread http://forum.OttawaGolf.com/showthre...-balance-plate

[tman]

I can't thank you enough for spending the time responding. I'll see what good stuff Cory has to say and figure something out I guess. Just have worked so hard saving and building the room for this. Just want it done to enjoy I guess. You live only once I keep telling myself.

Good day all. Really hard not to take Martins systems serious because of the info he gives and the price point of his products. The LX surround looks much like the about golf but les then maybe half the price. If it works great it would be so nice to only spend that then the ridiculous price aboutgolf wants. Anyone have or use any products form Martin and advanced golf sim?

[CPA]

If you are so keen than go ahead buy gsa. Do not say you were not warned. Read the lx thread.

[ZMax]

What????

Did you not read the thread CPA posted? Did you ever talk to Cory?

[mmlincon]

Oh tman.......
I agree the LX surround LOOKS amazing and is pretty much what we've all wanted for a long time now. I would say I am the most experienced person on this forum with AGS/GGS/GSA...whatever you want to call him. I'm pretty sure I've spent enough money with them to damn near cover the cost of an AboutGolf system. Well I just bought a ProTee system, so what does that tell you? For one I'm tired of waiting. His PX5 system, I think that's what its called now, works fine. That is the sensor board and two cameras. Very similar to ProTee. All the new stuff, LX Pro and LX Surround is untested and unproven. I swapped my PX sensor board for the club camera which was a big mistake. It was ok measuring path and face angle but never did speed right. The face angle had to be dialed in for each player and the markings on their club and it only worked good if you swung the exact same way every day.

Like I said in my previous post. Unless you are looking for a hobby look elsewhere. If you're up for it PM me. I may sell my serialized cameras and you can get an OEM LX Pro or Surround (if available ) and save a few bucks by building it yourself. I'm still considering it if I hear good things about the LX. I've invested so much already and I do like messing around with them.

[bubba22]

tman I really dont know wha to say. Good luck.! If you ge an LX, do post a review.

[tman]

We'll still up in arms. No sim yet and still no idea of which one to trust price and performance. Maybe a theatre room is in the future instead. Lol.

[Libbing]

Unless you are a scratch golfer or better that can hit a 5 yard draw or fade on command and actually play that way in real life, I think you are stressing too much on this. I go between a 3 and 7 handicap and think the Protee is accurate enough. The Protee shows you club path and face at impact etc and for the most part it gives a pretty accurate reflection of ball flight on the screen. In the end, if it fades or draws 10 yards instead of 5 it doesn't really matter that much - it keeps you in practice with the shape / direction of the swing you want and it is fun to play. The scratch golfers I play with pretty much know their swing and ball flight and if it isn't showing the outcome exactly, they know it and don't stress that it isn't perfect. Maybe if they were using it to practice for the PGA they'd feel different. They aren't, so they don't.

I've heard pretty good things about the GC2 as well. Let's keep in mind that no system is perfect because it is trying to simulate real life, which isn't really possible.

If you can accept a system that is a bit trickier to setup, but can handle lefties and righties in the same round, and is cheaper and gives club path and impact = Protee. If you are ok lacking club path data to get easy setup and are ok with it being a little more expensive = GC2. Want to avoid the floor sensor and the GC2 unit, then you are going to pay a lot of money for that (but 2-3x the cost won't make it 2-3 x more accurate, it's just a different setup). I think you'd be surprised how unobtrusive the GC2 unit is in reality. And it's not really a big deal to hit from the sensor mat with Protee despite it seeming so right now (my room is dedicated for this as well).

I don't think you need to mark clubs for the GC2?

You could consider a very simple setup at first with a GC2 unit. Just connect it to a laptop and hit into a cheap portable net and see the shape, etc. on the laptop. If you think it is accurate enough, build out the room. If you don't like it, the GC2 unit is easy to resell given its portability in design (that isn't a comment on resale value, but an observation that the unit isn't installed into a floor base). You could do that with a protee as well, just not quite as easy given the lighting requirements. But then you'll know whether you want to explore the really expensive stuff. Even if you lost $1000 on the resale, it's better than jumping into a $20-40k system without knowing whether you really need it.

[HSR]

good reply, Libbing.
In the middle of a DIYer right now. You do not need to mark clubs or ball on the GC2. Club head marking is required if you add their clubhead device - HMT.

[HSR]

good reply, Libbing.
In the middle of a DIYer right now. You do not need to mark clubs or ball on the GC2. Club head marking is required if you add their clubhead device - HMT.

[tman]

So I am going to go out on a limb here and say that there are two basic systems out there. Camera base that for any club data the club needs marked and a sensor mat for club head that no club marking is needed. Then a mystery one that pops up that is camera based but no need to mark the clubs. Does this stuff really work or is it all in the software trickery. The optishot is starting to look good. Save money and go on a golf trip. Lol.

[Libbing]

You need to Spend 30 minutes hitting on these and all will become clear (whether you want more than they offer or not); I am guessing anything short of that will leave you with stomach acid. Will have to defer to the gc2 crowd for the club marking and how much you really want that. I like looking at my club data but I know what I am doing wrong by the ball flight.

If the gc2 picks up draws, fades, pulls, pushes without club data, then you might be pretty happy with the basic system and no need to mark clubs. I thought it did that but maybe I am wrong. If it needs that add-on (requiring club marking) to pick those various ball flight patterns, then you'd want to do that.

[bubba22]

tman, what came about with your consult with Cory?

[ZMax]

IMO, any current camera based sim that claims to measure club data without markings are probably just very expensive Optishots.

GC2's spin measurements allow it to capture draws and fades. The HMT is just there to show club data, which does not factor in the simulation.

[tman]

He was sick the day we where suppose to hook up. Then I got sick so hope early next week to chat again. I've tried the two systems he has at the golf store and don't think I care for them. Not sure what now but I'll still call and talk to him again as he seems like a priceless piece of info and great to talk to.