Ready to launch

[xdreamgolf]

Hello all!

Let me first say Thank You!

The information in this site is by far second to none in regards to "simulating" what happens to that darn little white ball we all love and hate so much..

I will try to keep this short (not easy for me).

First let me just say I am the type of person who likely from the day I developed any hand eye coordination, I started taking things apart.. Fortunately I was also gifted with a mind set gave me the ability to understand why and how all of the things taken apart worked..Which over time allowed me to learn more and more with each project..I liken it to a snowball rolling down hill through sticky wet snow, a knowledge snowball if you will.. My greatest asset is having a sticky mind..

What this makes me is a Jack of all trades, who is a master of many.. There is nothing better for me than to find people who are far more intelligent, and possess a much greater knowledge about something of interest to me..

About 9 months ago golf got me, big time.. So I started taking it apart.. First to improve and during that process constantly thinking "that's a good idea, would anyone pay for it?".. Most of them had to be filled in the "not now folder", but one idea kept coming back with "I can figure that out and do that now"..

That's why I am here now.. The project came from my interest in golf simulators..I will soon have up and running a very professional, and accurate as the client needs it mobile simulator for hire.. I will share photo's as things progress..Other than the hardware and software it's is all me and my crazy head.. The only part of this I have had to put in the "not now folder" would be the hardware and software..That part for now will have to come from others who have accomplished such.. However I will say there is a dedicated file in my mind for the future to which I constantly add bits and pieces knowing when I in fact have the time it will be game on..

If you made it this far I do have some questions.. Feedback, experiences, suggestions as they relate would be greatly appreciated...


Accusport Vector Pro with Micro- E6 software good/not so?

E6 software sources not new version?

E6 longest drive and pin contests- Anyone ever participated?

Any longest drive and pin contest- Good/bad equipment and software used?

Other game play and contest software via aftermarket?

Any feedback, opinions, advice, knowledge, good or not so is greatly appreciated!

Thanks,
Kevin

P.S. GHIN just fell below 20.. Last August when I started keeping an "real score" I averaged just under 120.. Shooting to be sub 15 before green turns to white...

[Msuzippy]

The only part of this I have had to put in the "not now folder" would be the hardware and software..

Wat?

[CPA]

If you are going to hire/rent it out you will need better than accusport. Suggest you read threads.

What exactly are you wanting to do?

[xdreamgolf]

Wat?

I intend to build my own tracking hardware at some point in the future.. If not for nothing I will learn something.. Several ideas which I have not seen tried as well as a doing things with what is out there.. Just differently..

All for a later date as it is very unlikely to ever make me any money anytime soon.

[xdreamgolf]

If you are going to hire/rent it out you will need better than accusport. Suggest you read threads.

What exactly are you wanting to do?

Winter leagues a few nights a week.. Also events, shows, long drive, pin contests.. I will be there to set up run and tear down... Not Leasing or renting for anyone else to use.. So the system can really be anything as long as I know how to make it work well..

I have read too many posts and am now searching and reading again so I can make sure I do not miss something.. Nothing I have read for the most part had anything ill to say about Accusport.. At least the Pro with the micro lens.. I have one coming and will be doing anything I can with it.. I hope to integrate it into my sim for a couple reasons... Not only should it be able to add some accuracy, but more importantly record a miss hit as a miss hit... I don't want a nozzle rocket going dead right showing up on the screen as a nice high flying fade as so many simulators will show...Another reason I would like two separate sensors would be for redundancy... Nothing would be worse that booking a big weekend for a big client and have something happen to the hardware... Having two systems running in tangent will be great and if one goes down they will be able to run independently of each other..

Why would you not recommend Accusport?

[bubba22]

I am trying to follow you xdream but you are typing too fast. Let's slow down a minute so we can all understand. All I got was you are interested in Accusport and you want to integrate it into your sim (what sim?) and you want 2 separate sensors? What exactly are you doing?

[xdreamgolf]

Typing too fast??? I do still use a full size keyboard and can type with all my fingers.. My bad if anyone is reading this on a phone as I would likely be hard to follow..

1- I am building a mobile sim for daily rentals..Shows, Events, general crowd gathering.. It will also be used locally during the winter for golf leagues at a couple different places..Monday night here, Tuesday night I go there, and likely somewhere for another night.

2- I did just purchase a Accusport Vector Pro with the updated lens... This one did not come with V-range and would like input on some of the independent launch monitor software on the market.. I.E. Optimal Flight.

3- My sim is being constructed such that I will be able to have two systems.. One will be based on the Vector alone running E6 golf or at a minimum projecting a driving range on the big screen... The other system which has yet to be determined will likely be pad based and used for game play as well as contests... In a perfect world the two will live in perfect harmony and work in tandem to provide actual ball flight...In the real world I would be happy getting them just to play together and not fight!!!

4- If I can get them to play together nicely great.. Now if one of them gets sick the other can still get through the day on it's own..

5- I will save that for later...Trying to slow down,,, but it ' s h ar d ..

[bubba22]

Ok. Gotcha. May I suggest you get a Trugolf system and the Accusport. Trugolf I sensor based, has E6 and is integrated with Accusport. Out of interest, how do you plan on linking Accuport Vector to another sensor based system?

[ZMax]

Don't take offense but if you have already bought a vector, then you've reading the wrong threads. Try GC2 for a mobile setup.

[bubba22]

Better advice ZMax!

[xdreamgolf]

Thanks Bubba22... Trugolf is very likely although I was a bit put of by one of there reps when I tried to get some information a few months ago.. Maybe it was just a bad day and I seemed like one of the hundreds of callers he has to field.. Don't know it was just a bad first impression.. As it stands and unless someone else has another idea it will likely be them...From what I gather there pad does a decent job with the club and everyone loves e6... As far as linking the vector to another system;;; well I am still working on that and have made some great progress, but still need to take some more stuff apart and find someone much more familiar with programming than I am... And in full disclosure I will not be selling any breakthroughs nor will I be looking to pirate anything...If I need to get in I will get permission... I can say that there are plenty of things that have failed for one reason or another that are free for the taking and should provide me with great insight...

[bubba22]

Well you seem committed. Good luck with it and keep us posted. Accusport is ok. It can't detect chip or putts. There are better units out there.

[xdreamgolf]

No offense taken... However at less than a 1/3 the price with similar ball capture it will work for now..GC2 will be a consideration for my next sim and not see the same fate the vector will once I start messing with it...
Yes the vector is finicky,, set up can be a pain ( custom mat/jig and likely aiming laser for duplicating position should fix that ).. And it is about 5 times bigger than it really needs to be so it's not fancy, but I can make up for that elsewhere..

[bubba22]

I hope it works out 4 you. Vector is finicky but cheaper. Right - left usage is also an issue!

[xdreamgolf]

Will do bubba22... Yeah it would only really work well on it's own with the contests... Longest drive etc.. I am aware of the issue with slow club speeds and putting....Really wish I had purchase a protee last year before they updated there software and price~! They are still a consideration and would work great for the league play...If I could afford two systems that would solve many of my issues...Unless you have figured out how to integrate protee and accusport? I'd even be interested cheap and getting cheaper zelosity units if they would work with protee...I know they only calculate spin, but measured spin is greatly over rated when you can measure everything else.. Those in the right hands could do a damn good job with ball speed and launch angle...Why know one is doing that yet is another question for another day...

[xdreamgolf]

I hope it works out 4 you. Vector is finicky but cheaper. Right - left usage is also an issue!

I believe I got the right left issue handled.. Will post a pick when it's done and if it works well...

[bubba22]

I believe I got the right left issue handled.. Will post a pick when it's done and if it works well...

Cool!

[xdreamgolf]

Before I forget... If anyone asks about curtains and such for there low budget sim project.. Have them search ebay for "used stage curtains".. you would be amazed what $100 will get you....

[ZMax]

I would think twice about Trugolf. It does not measure face angle as well as you think.

Definitely no to Zelocity.

Agreed that measured spin is over rated, but IMO, it's only over rated because there isn't a device yet that can measure spin axis correctly 99% of the time indoors. The GC2 is good most of the time but there are still instances where it fails. Even the $60K AboutGolf is not perfect.

The Vector was an inexpensive purchase so no big deal there. Patience and stay tuned.....

[Frans@france]

I'm sure you will have fun with this project

Put based on the quotes below I think you need to read some more threads

..... but measured spin is greatly over rated when you can measure everything else.....

You will change your ideas about this as soon as you have two sims next to each other one with spin and the other without spin and start playing on both. Hitting a 5000rpm iron 7 is going to fly and stop different then a 7000rpm. Put that into optimal flight and you will see that the 5000 rpm will be longer and is hard to hold the green and the 7000rpm will be much shorter and does hold the green. Depending on green conditions. Also note that having the correct landing angle on the 5000rpm is much harder because the apex is lower.

... I'd even be interested cheap and getting cheaper zelosity units ....

Here you really need to read some more

[bubba22]

xdream definitely read up on the Zelocity! Frans you bring up a great point that has been discussed here before. The physics of impact after the ball hits the green is completely dependent on the game/range software. How the ball should react on the green or fairway/ rough compared to real we will never know. No different than in real golf depending on what the course conditions are. I don't think measuring spin is greatly overrated. The ideal is to be as precise as possible. Many companies that claim to measure spin with a spin cam such as Sportscoach, Foregolf, Full Swing, Optigolf, Bogolf! Visual Sports actually "calculate spin". Now that's ok and still make them good and fun to play but these companies should be more transparent in their claims. Shall I say lying!!!!

[xdreamgolf]

I'm sure you will have fun with this project

Put based on the quotes below I think you need to read some more threads


You will change your ideas about this as soon as you have two sims next to each other one with spin and the other without spin and start playing on both. Hitting a 5000rpm iron 7 is going to fly and stop different then a 7000rpm. Put that into optimal flight and you will see that the 5000 rpm will be longer and is hard to hold the green and the 7000rpm will be much shorter and does hold the green. Depending on green conditions. Also note that having the correct landing angle on the 5000rpm is much harder because the apex is lower.

Ball spin

Here you really need to read some more

Frans@france..I would guess you are a very good golfer with not only good equipment, but well maintained equipment..

Very few golfers in general, very very few;

A) have the skill to control spin.
B) maintain their irons so even if they do get lucky and get a spin worthy strike on the ball it will spin to it's potential.
C) could tell if spin was measured or calculated on a simulator as long as the number was consistent !!!!
The above C is one of those things you learn if you are familiar with an equipment sales rep.. All they need to sell you new and improved whatever is the ability to control something in the software which makes it appear to be better than what you have..Unfortunately it happens far too often!!!! As it is very easy to add a little something to the program and change end numbers..

Fact- less than 10% of golfers can break 100 consistently, (ones that can add anyway) . Please don't reply with GHIN stats because a huge number of golfers even very good ones, do not maintain a HC..

I am still working on breaking 90 consistently and trying to play as often as possible. Personally until I can, there just ain't no spin gonna help me...Low 80's? maybe, I hope so... Direction in my opinion will get me there !!!! I.E. Straight!!!

As far as the Zelocity systems go. I have read tons.. They never should have made the claims they did which is the root of their demise.. I do think radar is a good way to see angles and speed indoors at least...Spin indoors with anything radar has some calculation in it period!!! Even the best product will tell you that..

Zelocity products are getting so cheap they will be great for messing around with in my shop. Experiment if you will.... I am sure everyone here would cringe if I said I was going to buy a trakman just to take it apart

The only criticism (not really criticism) I have with this site is that some members seem to forget just what a small percentage of the general golf population they compile.. My guess would be most here guys/gals are 2%ers... You all are damn good golfers!!! Just don't forget the vast majority are not and that does not even include all the dudes that always drive the ball 300 yards !! Myself unless it carries 305 I must have been distracted

[bubba22]

I think the forum represent all golfing ranges. There are many on her who are technical and want perfection however there are just as many that are high handicapper that are satisfied with an Optishot. Just look at the Dancing dogg thread. . The cost of the Zelocity is going down for a reason. I am not even sure if the company is still around? At that low price, buying a unit that you can dismantle and work on is great. Go for it and keep us posted. Fact is there are tonnes of golf sim/launch monitor companies that are in business to sell and make money. The market is out there. I think there are many options for users, which i great. An open source sim/launch unit option eould be awesome. My only beef is that the various companies are making false claims or twisting various buzz words like measured spin etc. to help their sales!

[xdreamgolf]

I think the forum represent all golfing ranges. There are many on her who are technical and want perfection however there are just as many that are high handicapper that are satisfied with just an look at the Dancing dogg thread. . The cost of the Zelocity is going down for a reason. I am not even sure if the company is still around? At that low price, buying a unit that you can dismantle and work on is great. Go for it and keep us posted. Fact is there are tonnes of golf sim/launch monitor companies that are in business to sell and make money. The market is out there. I think there are many options for users, which i great. An open source sim/launch unit option eould be awesome. My only beef is that the various companies are making false claims or twisting various buzz words like measured spin etc. to help their sales!

Yeah I could throw something together and claim to be another "most accurate simulator in the world" sell the crap out of it,, and hope I made some money before it all fell apart as so many have.. Say what you can do... Too many claim far more!!!

Spin is just a subject I could go on for a very long time and one of the big reasons so may claim to measure it.. Buyers think they need it...I can't tell you how many posts and reviews I found that were very happy with Zelocity and thought that it was quite accurate.. However they were old and before everyone realized how much of a calculation they were using!!! They are no longer selling under that name I did find a new site attempting to revive the products xtremeradar.com to bad it's similar to my name..Don't know much about it yet but at some point I am sure I'll hear something...

Holiday golf?? Pad any better than trugolf,p3pro ? It does measure ball speed..

[Frans@france]

A) have the skill to control spin.

I used these two values because that is the average difference between playing a prov1 or some type of long distance hard cover ball (read cheap).

As far as the Zelocity systems go. I have read tons.. They never should have made the claims they did which is the root of their demise.. I do think radar is a good way to see angles and speed indoors at least...Spin indoors with anything radar has some calculation in it period!!! Even the best product will tell you that..

- Zelocity was not about claims! It is about fake data produced by the zelocity software. If you want to know more read the document I wrote about it http://www.launchpi.com/forum/unders...ch_topic5.html

- No idea what you mean with calculations because all machines need to do calculations to get information out of the raw data, being photo or radar. Even the most simple radar unit is good in reading spin if the ball has a dot. I would need just a few lines of code to get the spin values from a radar. I need special computer vision libs trying to read spin from multiple images. Why do I know? Because I did both trying to check spin reported by the TM and spin reported by the Vector Pro.

please note I'm not talking about spin axis here but only total spin.

[bubba22]

Holiday golf is a reasonable pad. Similar to ProTee or GSA. They sell under the name Personal Pro which is their base unit.

[bubba22]

Interesting that Zelocity changed their name! I wonder why?

[ZMax]

Holiday golf?? Pad any better than trugolf,p3pro ? It does measure ball speed..

The Holiday golf pad is shadow based similar to Trugolf and Protee. P3pro and Optishot are reflective based. Very little user experience here on the forum. Last year, one person, who owns an indoor golf facility using Holiday golf machines, came on here an expressed that the systems were not reliable. He though about selling them and switching to something else.

They now have a camera LA option. Not sure how well that it works.

As for spin, Protee's estimated spin is good enough for me(12 hdcp) and I'm sure it's good enough for most golfers. But if you got the funds to get spin within 100-200 rpms, then by all means, go for it. I have a problem with those that completely lie or use lookup tables.

[Frans@france]

Interesting that Zelocity changed their name! I wonder why?

I don't think it has changed it's name. Reading what is stated on the website this is a new company owning the old zelocity products. From what I read it sounds like like parent company is the same that was responsible for the manufcturing of the zelocity units....

[ZMax]

Interesting that Zelocity changed their name! I wonder why?

Because the internet works. Perhaps we need to start warning people of their new name?