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Thread: Attending the Flagstick
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05-25-2005 03:54 PM #31Originally Posted by LobWedge
Originally Posted by LobWedge
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05-25-2005 05:08 PM #32Originally Posted by Gary Hill
Respectfully, Rich.When applying the Rules, you follow them line by line. You don't read between them.
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05-25-2005 05:53 PM #33Originally Posted by LobWedge
I meant that MY stupid post OFFENDED ME.
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05-25-2005 06:05 PM #34Originally Posted by Gary Hill
Thanks again for continuing to provide the answers to the questions. I admire and share your passion for the game.When applying the Rules, you follow them line by line. You don't read between them.
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05-25-2005 07:53 PM #35
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I keep reading through the rules and cannot find where it says there is a penalty for hitting an unattended flag stick not in the hole.
17-3 says . . . while being attended, removed, or held up . . .
. . . when in the hole, unattended . . .
And per the rules of reading the simple rules of golf, not reading into the rules something that is not there, I don't get it.Last edited by HiG4s; 05-25-2005 at 08:04 PM.
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05-25-2005 08:11 PM #36Originally Posted by HiG4s
The player’s ball must not strike:
a. The flagstick when it is being attended, removed or held up;
I am steering clear of the grammar involved (I already got burned on that one), but the Rule means "removed". It does not mean "being removed".
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05-25-2005 08:30 PM #37
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Originally Posted by Gary Hill
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05-25-2005 08:42 PM #38
Uh oh...
Gary, I swear to god that I didn't put him up to it.When applying the Rules, you follow them line by line. You don't read between them.
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05-25-2005 08:44 PM #39
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05-25-2005 08:47 PM #40
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Not to beat a dead horse..
but per the rules of grammer
in Strunk and Whites, Elements of Style
III, 13. Omit all unnecessary words.
an article or a preposition applying to all the members of a series must either be used only before the first term or else be repeated before each term.
So the "is being" is applied to all terms.
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05-25-2005 08:49 PM #41
The horse has been burried ,no sence in beating it anymore.
Last edited by NoBack; 05-25-2005 at 10:48 PM.
I've spent most of my life golfing .... the rest I've just wasted"
www.nationalcapitalgolftour.com
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05-25-2005 09:00 PM #42Originally Posted by Steve KaramIt could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.
Colby
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05-25-2005 09:03 PM #43Originally Posted by ColbyWhen applying the Rules, you follow them line by line. You don't read between them.
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05-25-2005 09:05 PM #44Originally Posted by ColbyWhen applying the Rules, you follow them line by line. You don't read between them.
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05-26-2005 07:47 AM #45Originally Posted by HiG4s
"being attended" is using the past progessive form of the verb "to be" indicating an action that is in past but not finished.
It does not apply to "removed" or "held up" whose actions are finished.
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05-26-2005 07:47 AM #46Originally Posted by LobWedgeIt could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.
Colby
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05-26-2005 07:51 AM #47Originally Posted by LobWedge
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05-26-2005 08:28 AM #48Big_duckGuestOriginally Posted by Gary Hill
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05-26-2005 08:53 AM #49Originally Posted by Gary HillI've spent most of my life golfing .... the rest I've just wasted"
www.nationalcapitalgolftour.com
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05-26-2005 12:07 PM #50Originally Posted by Steve KaramWhen applying the Rules, you follow them line by line. You don't read between them.
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04-26-2013 09:53 AM #51BillVBGuest
Hitting an attended flagstick with a putt
This almost happenned yesterday and no one understood the rule for certain, even after looking up Rule 17.
All players in the 4-some are competitors - no partners, no caddies.
Play A is the putter, Player B (his competitor) attends the pin.
Player B fails to pull the pin and Player A's putt strikes it. (note: Player B could have doene this deliberately, carelessly, or the pin could have been stuck. You simply cannot determine or base a rule on Player B's intent unless you can get in his brain)
Does anyone get a penalty, if so who? Does the putt have to be replayed?
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04-26-2013 10:32 AM #52
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17-3/2
Opponent or Fellow-Competitor Attending Flagstick for Player Fails to Remove It; Player's Ball Strikes Flagstick
Q. A's ball lies on the putting green. A requests B, his opponent or fellow-competitor, to attend the flagstick, and B complies. A putts and B fails to remove the flagstick. A's ball strikes the flagstick. What is the ruling?
A. If B failed to remove the flagstick for the purpose of causing A to incur a penalty, B is disqualified, in both match play and stroke play, under Rule 33-7 for taking an action contrary to the spirit of the game. In stroke play, in equity (Rule 1-4), A must replay the stroke without penalty.
If B's failure to remove the flagstick was with the intent to influence the movement of A's ball (e.g., for the purpose of preventing A's ball from going beyond the flagstick), B is in breach of Rule 1-2, and loses the hole in match play or incurs a two-stroke penalty in stroke play, whether the ball strikes the flagstick or not. In stroke play, if the ball struck the flagstick and as a result A suffered significant advantage or disadvantage, then the Committee could consider B to have committed a serious breach of Rule 1-2, the penalty for which is disqualification. Whether or not B has committed a serious breach of Rule 1-2, in stroke play, if A's ball struck the flagstick, in equity (Rule 1-4), A must replay the stroke without penalty - see Note 2 to Rule 1-2.
If B's failure to remove the flagstick was not deliberate (e.g., the flagstick stuck in the hole-liner or B was distracted and did not see A putt), since B was acting on A's behalf, A incurs a penalty of loss of hole in match play or two strokes in stroke play under Rule 17-3. A must play the ball as it lies. B incurs no penalty. (Revised)
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