Swing arc - hitting from the inside question

[sabzor]

I typically play a fade as it's my natural shot shape, but over the past while I've decided that I would be much more comfortable playing a draw if possible.

Sounds counter to most good players who fear the left side I guess but I've always had a pretty hard body rotation so the fade comes easy. To be honest my logic behind it all is that my miss has always been to the right and I would be much more comfortable knowing that no matter what I do I'm not going to lose it right.

Haha I realize someone is going to hit me with the Martin Kaymer scenario.

Anyways, here is my question. I play the ball about 3 inches off my left heel for pretty much all shots and vary stance width. Lately I've found it difficult to feel like I'm hitting the ball from the inside and by that I mean that I normally feel like I'm hitting it just at or past the apex of the arc where the club is starting to come back to the inside (not to be confused with over the top). I'm pretty content with the overall action of the swing itself so I think it's probably something small. I find moving the ball back in my stance doesn't help that much as I tend to get stuck and then end up having to come over it to get at the ball.

I realize it's hard to know the true issue without a video or something but I'm thinking it's a function of me not keeping my head back enough?

[nokids]

I've been taught to let the ball decide the trajectory. The key, I'm told, is to swing HARD. If you're worried about swing arc and planes, you're going to wimp out at impact. Hit it with intent.

Thanks youtube!

[BC MIST]

Lately I've found it difficult to feel like I'm hitting the ball from the inside and by that I mean that I normally feel like I'm hitting it just at or past the apex of the arc where the club is starting to come back to the inside (not to be confused with over the top). I'm pretty content with the overall action of the swing itself so I think it's probably something small. I find moving the ball back in my stance doesn't help that much as I tend to get stuck and then end up having to come over it to get at the ball.

If you are fading because your alignment is open to the target line, then any other adjustment to encourage a "draw" will likely result in a severe hook.

A pure draw (starts right of target line and gently curves back to target line) is very simple to achieve.
1. Everything you own should be aligned parallel to the target line, at address.
2. The club head path is from the inside.
3. The club face is slightly open at ball/club separation.

When assured that your alignment is perfect and a ball is hit, where the ball starts relative to the target line and in which direction and how much it curves, will tell you whether you need to alter your swing, or possibly your grip, in order to achieve the desired right to lft ball flight.

[sabzor]

If you are fading because your alignment is open to the target line, then any other adjustment to encourage a "draw" will likely result in a severe hook.

A pure draw (starts right of target line and gently curves back to target line) is very simple to achieve.
1. Everything you own should be aligned parallel to the target line, at address.
2. The club head path is from the inside.
3. The club face is slightly open at ball/club separation.

When assured that your alignment is perfect and a ball is hit, where the ball starts relative to the target line and in which direction and how much it curves, will tell you whether you need to alter your swing, or possibly your grip, in order to achieve the desired right to lft ball flight.

This was a great post. The more I look at things I think that I naturally tend to gravitate to a bit of an open stance (even if I feel I'm parallel to the target line). I'm sure that the way I'm set up is probably the key fundamental that I'm not properly adhering too. Maybe I just tend to not like feeling closed as subconsciously it makes me think I'm going to push it straight into the right woods. If anything I probably have to feel a little closed if anything. I understand all the new ball flight laws so I'm going to do my best to not roll release but hit solid with the differential between face and path.

[BC MIST]

I understand all the new ball flight laws so I'm going to do my best to not roll release but hit solid with the differential between face and path.

If my perception of your "roll release" is the same, it is, IMO, a fundamental cause of inconsistency as it necessitates conscious mental activity and perfect timing, to "square the face." If you have superior athletic talent - go for it, but, if you are a mortal, then a different approach may help.

I learned decades ago from Mark Evershed et al, that keeping the "left wrist FLAT and the right wrist BENT," coming through the ball, eliminates timing and simply allows inertia to release the leverage angles in proper sequence, without conscious thought. The hands finish the swing low, more around the body and the club does not go "out of bounds" behind you, but stays more vertical as you finish. This gives you greatly increased accuracy, and if you want some extra ooomph, just rotate faster coming through, keeping the left FLAT and the right BENT for as long as possible.

Last thought: As the downswing starts, feel your hands moving back and away from you, 180* from your target. This simple motion drops the club into the "slot," from which very little can go wrong. Most golfers move back to the ball, or over the ideal plane (not over the top)instead of away from it. Watch this classic move, here - http://www.pgatour.com/swingplex/00/65/22/index.html. Els pushes his hands back towards the camera first BEFORE they come out to the ball. When the hands are at right shoulder height, you can actually see the right shoulder. Perfection.

[sabzor]

BC MIST,

This has been some great stuff. Most of what you say when you talk about creating a stable face and rotating it through impact (ie. flat left wrist and bent right) is primarily what I subscribe to. This is obviously the gravitating trend in tour pros these days along with the whole 'swing left' idea.

As the downswing starts, feel your hands moving back and away from you, 180* from your target. This simple motion drops the club into the "slot," from which very little can go wrong.

This bit of advice might be a bit of a game changer for me. I've forever struggled with the transition from backswing to downswing. I'm normally pretty good at maintaining pretty passive arms and hands up to the top and I often found myself a bit lost on where to go. Only recently after watching lots of footage of guys like Tiger/Rory as well as Hunter Mahan (who I feel is almost perfect in his simplicity), I began to notice more of a push up and off their left leg rather than a deliberate slide/turn (seems to happen on its own) that in doing this I give myself some room to stay down and through the shot vice backing my spine out of it in order to hit the ball.

That being said I would have issues getting stuck having my body rotate too fast and leave my hands behind or trying to throw my hands it and getting into all kinds of inconsistent contact. This feel of pushing away seems so counter intuitive but really seems to set things and allows me to create that stretch in my left side and really feel the opposition.

Great stuff, just wanted to say thanks! haha where have you been, seems like you could sort me out pretty quick and get me on the right path.

[BC MIST]

This feel of pushing away seems so counter intuitive but really seems to set things and allows me to create that stretch in my left side and really feel the opposition.

https://www.golfbetterproductions.co...-swing-dvd.asp
Most golfers swing problems are caused by right shoulder roll, right arm thrust and right hand cast, and in that sequence. In looking at the pic of John Dunnigan in the upper right side of the page in this link, some would say that he would be in the "stuck" position. Rather, IMO, it is perfection and caused by the hands/arms pushing "back," away from the target. This moves initially eliminates the three problems mentioned above.

If you combine the initial move back with maintaining the backward bend in the right wrist coming through and with the "swing left" that you mentioned above, it's hard to hit it crooked. Hitting good shots is not that difficult and achieving the few things we have mentioned in this thread will go a long way to improve anyone's game.

[sabzor]

I actually watched a bunch of Mark Evershed's stuff on youtube and he's basically talking about exactly what I'm trying to achieve. He seems to want you to maintain that bend in your right wrist all the way to the finish. I find that odd to hold through the ball but I feel like I can do it with this weird 'roll' at the bottom. It's strange though as it feels like im trying to hit the ball with the face pointed straight at the ground. If I swing slow and rotate though it seems to 'look' completely normal.

[BC MIST]

I actually watched a bunch of Mark Evershed's stuff on youtube and he's basically talking about exactly what I'm trying to achieve. He seems to want you to maintain that bend in your right wrist all the way to the finish. I find that odd to hold through the ball but I feel like I can do it with this weird 'roll' at the bottom. It's strange though as it feels like im trying to hit the ball with the face pointed straight at the ground. If I swing slow and rotate though it seems to 'look' completely normal.

Mark is a "The Golfing Machine" guy, with his own variations on the theme. The best swing that I have seen is Mac O'Grady's, another TGM pro, who also advocates the leftward movement of the arms/hands. It can be easily demonstrated, but the leftward movement is what squares the face, (no timing issue) rather than a roll of the arms/hands (perfect timing required) . Interestingly, O'Grady's left hand swing is virtually identical to his right handed one. Too many instructors still teach "swing down the line," IMO, a recipe for disaster.