Choosing the right simulator

[blehrer]

Hi all. ive been doing some research and curious on your thoughts. here is a list of what is important to me:

No sensors in the hitting area
No club taping
Want both ball and club info
would like options to view ball flight
good graphics

looking to spend under 40k and obviously lower would be better but i want to get it right.

i came up with hd golf/fullswing s1/gc2 w/hmt/flightscope x1 or x2

here were issues i had with each one:

hd golf-only one view for ball flight, graphics not 3d(although pictures look good)
fullswing-seems like people here have accuracy issues and dont really like it
gc2 w/ hmt-hmt needs labels on clubs
flightscope-not vey familiar with it, seems more instructional than game play

would love some input on where i may be wrong or any other thoughts
thanks.

[ZMax]

GC2 is the only one in your list that has good graphics. The E6's ball flight views put me to sleep.

Flightscope requires a lot of room for indoor and an extra putting sensor, which I don't know if it's available yet. Also, for indoors, spin axis and club face are both estimated. Somebody posted a review of the X1 recently.

The videos of the HMT(2) both showed readings that didn't make sense. They might have it working accurately now. If you get it, let us know if it's accurate.

Read the HDgolf thread. I would not buy it.

[blehrer]

thanks z...how about full swing? the new graphics look amazing although i know i cant be sure if/when they will come out.

[ZMax]

Fullswing uses E6 also, which is ok but just not as good as Red Chain. See my E6 review. The S1 estimates side spin from a measured club path and an estimated club face(from ball path). A lot of estimating going on similar to the X1. The S1, which uses the same hardware as Sportcoach/Foregolf, is a decent simulator according to Bubba22, but don't look for accurate club measurments/estimations. Some of the videos on Youtube really show the problems.

As you can see, there is no perfect simulator. Just figure out what you want your sim to do accurately and what you're willing to live with.

As for the new or updated GPS golf graphics, they don't look to that great to me.

[bubba22]

100% agree with ZMax.

[CPA]

Blehrer
You have quickly found the most frustrating decision in sim golf.
The answer is that there is no answer ,even with $40K. If you want graphics and accuracy the GC2 is for you. The HMT will give you club data but with stickers and no swing plane like X2 or Trackman, presuming as well they have fixed accuracy. The indoor ball spin for X2 and trackman have been questioned. At the end of the day do you really need club data? After a short time with GC2 you will be able to work out what the club was doing.

I am testing swingbyte as an option for club data. The bugs are being fixed and will soon be in a position to get an idea of its accuracy.

[Andisblue]

I'd go gc2 without a doubt. It seems like a no-brainer. You can drive, chip, putt, and even kick the ball off of any type of turf, even a real strip of fairway that you shoveled out of the golf course in the middle of the night ( i dont support this action). The graphics are pretty decent as far as sims go. I score the same on the sim as in real life, and I think that really says something.

[syhlif32]

It really comes down to what Zmax says. You will not get a simulator that is a perfect fit for you.
If you want the simulator for simulating golf game then you will be fine without club info. If you want it for practicing and improving you will need club info. Or have a very good coach standing next to you.
No simulator is accurate! Not even Trackman clams to be accurate unless the can see most of the ball flight.
I got a Protee and it's ball flight is not accurate ether. But it has a lot of options to adjust the parameters so you can get it to look like what you see on the course with the balls that you are playing. That is time consuming and not for everyone.

For practice on the simulator I only pay attention to ball speed LA and club information.

I too wish I did not have floor sensors and cables everywhere but for my lack of golf skills I would not improve without the club information.

[psace]

Good info from everyone. It is important to note that many simulator companies are currently testing spin cameras so the field will be more similar in the near future as far as accuracy is concerned.

[blehrer]

Just demo'd the fullswing system down at their r&d in vero beach. I really liked what I saw.....and what was even better was the new graphics they are coming out with. The driving range and some other cool stuff is coming out 6/1. Courses with the new graphics will follow shortly. I was getting close to going with the gc2 but the new graphics on fullswing combined with the stickers necessary to get club head info on the gc2 has swayed me back to fullswing. I should have the system up and running by the end of June and will report back.

For anybody who doesn't know, Cory at par2pro.com has a wealth of knowledge and unlike salespeople pushing a particular product, his goal is to help you make the right decision for yourself. I highly recommend people get in touch with him if they are interested in buying a sim

Thanks to all those who replied to my thread.

[bubba22]

Great blehrer. Keep us posted with reviews and screenshots of your sim. Everybody here should be aware and are aware of Cory except the newbees. He's a great guy and has helped many of us here.

[rdh]

Holy cow - the new graphics engine for fullswing looks spectacular. There's a preview video here: http://www.fullswinggolf.com/video-g...-environments/.

[bubs3141]

it does look amazing but then again e6 looked great in a video but when I got it, it did not look the same. The video preview is probably at a much higher resolution than what is put out for the sim.

[bubba22]

Good point bubs. I agree with rdh as it does look very nice.

[Par2Pro]

I am in San Diego now and have my meeting with Full Swing tomorrow. I will try to get a video of the new graphics as well as more info

[blehrer]

I am in San Diego now and have my meeting with Full Swing tomorrow. I will try to get a video of the new graphics as well as more info

Hi Cory, how'd it go with full swing? Were you able to see any of the new software in action?

[Par2Pro]

Full Swing was great, but the software wasn't ready for me to test. I have seen the flyover videos a few times now and think that it is fantastic, but can't say for sure until it is available and ready for testing.

On a side note, Full Swing is now distributing Sports Coach. Guys like myself will be their retail channel as they want to separate the Full Swing line from anything else. Look for more details soon

[rdh]

Hey Cory - Did you find out whether the new software is something they are developing in-house, or whether a third party is working on it?

[Par2Pro]

There is a software development team that they are working with. I can't reveal too much more at this point though

[HuskerFL]

This is just the best forum for golf sim information. I am in the same situation as Bleher's original post: a great system for about $40k. I have demo'ed HDgolf and Fullswing. Fullswing is far superior in shot rendering and accuracy, no special balls, and ability to capture almost any shot. However with the spin camera, full room setup and video capture we were looking at close to $60k, but they did offer me upgrades to software and graphics. The spin camera alone is much larger than the GC2 unit and obviously the unit is not portable. Now that I've read alot of your posts I will start investigating Foresight. It sounds like the new graphics for Fullswing are promising. Are there similar graphics upgrades in the works for Red Chain?

[bubba22]

Husked, if you are in Orlando why not go look and demo the Flightscope systems?

[CPA]

Are there similar graphics upgrades in the works for Red Chain?

thread here

http://forum.ottawagolf.com/showthre...ext-Gen-Engine

[CPA]

And for GC2 Cory talks about new sotware here

http://forum.ottawagolf.com/showthre...Versions/page2

[Par2Pro]

Welcome Husker, you can also find a place to demo the GC2 in Florida. If you contact myself (cory@par2pro.com) or Foresight we can help find one close to you

[markryangolf]

Do multiple companies work with the same graphics company E6 (ie license it?). What is everyone's thoughts about best graphics out there?

[CPA]

Do multiple companies work with the same graphics company E6 (ie license it?). What is everyone's thoughts about best graphics out there?

many use E6 ie flightscope, trackman
many use redchain ie foresight gc2

some use all eg GSA

some have their own

a year ago Cory was going to take shots of the actual projected screen of each and upload but I think he got sidetracked. Suggest you will have to see for yourself.

[Par2Pro]

For a long time E6 was only available for TruGolf and Full Swing simulators, but within the past year or so the owner decided to sell it to other simulator companies. Some companies bought in like ProTee, GSA, Accusport, FlightScope, and Trackman.

Red Chain was originally Custom Play golf, an online golf game that a couple of companies ended up using for their simulators. GSA got distribution rights and started selling to other companies, as well as Red Chain sold to other simulator companies as well. Red Chain is available with P3ProSwing, GSA, ProTee, Foresight Sports, IGS, VSS, and a handful of other companies.

Some people like aboutGolf manufacturer their own software which gives them a competitive edge with features such as the new aGView integration: http://youtu.be/wplOgcmebRY

Remember that what the software developers sell the simulator company is basically an SDK with a graphics engine, courses and basic GUI. They then have to develop an interface and then add on GUI, other features (what Foresight did was add ClubFitting software and changed things like the ball flight starting from where it hits the screen). These value-add features set it apart from other systems and also limit you from buying software from Red Chain directly; however, some customers have been able to work their magic with the manufacturer - (cough, cough, rdh ) but guys like rdh are programmers who know what they are doing. You probably won't find any company that was as open as GolfTek to providing their sdk. Maybe that's why they went out of business - Just Kidding

[Par2Pro]

a year ago Cory was going to take shots of the actual projected screen of each and upload but I think he got sidetracked. Suggest you will have to see for yourself.

Hey CPA - oops, did I not get to something? Are you saying that I was going to take pictures of the same software using the same projector and screen?

[CPA]

Hey CPA - oops, did I not get to something? Are you saying that I was going to take pictures of the same software using the same projector and screen?

I read a post where you were going to do a test of taking videos of different sim software side by side somehow so the person wathching got an idea of the different graphics.

You got busy obviously. ( metaphorically as well)

[CPA]

Hey CPA - oops, did I not get to something? Are you saying that I was going to take pictures of the same software using the same projector and screen?

I read a post where you were going to do a test of taking videos of different sim software side by side somehow so the person wathching got an idea of the different graphics.

You got busy obviously. ( metaphorically as well)