P3proswing swing speeds and distances

[Stonebattle]

This is my first post. Great forum

I thought I would share some data I've taken on the P3proswing sensor and software.

A few months ago I had a golf lesson with a pro with a Zelocity simulator.
I took some data from that lesson and compared it to that I got the same day from the P3proswing. Please see below:

Averages for both Zelocity and P3proswing are for 10 swing with the high and low numbers removed.

Smooth driver swing in all cases as close as I can make it.
Swing Speed Ball Speed Carry Dist. Total Dist. %Role
Zelocity - 99.9 147.2 234.1 258.8 9.6
P3ProSwing - 94.9 141.5 234.3 246.0 4.7

On a course, out of 8 drives(ones I could tell where the ball hit) during both rounds, in soft conditions, distances measured with a laser range finder, I averaged 234.3 yards carry one time and 235.6 yards carry another time. I measured a roll of 7.12% and 8.64% during these same rounds.

What I get out of this is the P3Proswing is very close when it comes to carry distances for the driver, although it does seem a bit low for swing speed. Total distance was also a bit low compared Zelocity and to the couses I play, but these can easily be adjusted

I have found on other simulators, my ball speeds are in the low 150 mph, so that data holds up.

If any of you have taken data as well. I would like to see it.

[Stonebattle]

I'm disappointed, I thought for sure there would be some other P3proswing users out there interested in what I was trying to do.

[goatbarn]

You should read up on the zelocity thread in the hardware forum here to see how accurate that launch monitor really is. I don't have a p3proswing though, sorry.

[bubba22]

Stonebattle, welcome. Are you trying to generate some discussion on the P3pro and its accuracy? There was no question in your thread so I assume your saying that your happy with the P3pro and how it compares to the Zelocity?

[ZMax]

Thanks for contributing but you're test is not valid. The P3pro does not measure the ball, only the club. The slow swing speed has been reported by many on this forum. The ball speed can be adjusted to get the carry that you want.

The Zelocity has been reported to be a fraud by many on the Internet. Google the Zelocity Purelaunch and Tracker.

Besides, you're comparing apples to oranges.

[Stonebattle]

Thanks Goatbarn I will do that

[Stonebattle]

bubba22 - Well sort of.
I've used a P3proswing for a few years now and it has served me very well. As a swing analyzer it's, IMHO, hard to beat. As a simulator, well not so much. I'm a three handycap and one of the things useful about swing analyzers/simulators is teaching typcial distances. Of course, the P3pro only measures club data, so those distances are often suspect and not quite right for all of my clubs. Adjusting the slider is a pain because I have to do way to much. This is were the Config file comes into play. Knowing ones actual distances is important and I decided to start by talking about carry distances. I guess that was not a good choice. So do others test their actual club distances and adjust the config file so the software produces the expected results for each club.

[Stonebattle]

No argument Zmax.
For several years now Ihave used the P3proswing just as a swing analyzer. I did not play the virtual courses. I've taken it to my course's driver range 3 times to take distance and shot spread data and compared actual to that reported in the software. I recently upgraded to the new grass top and started to play some of the virtual courses. Anyway, if I hit a PW 110 yards on the range and course I want the sensor and software to report 110 yards.

I did not know that about Zelocity. Very interesting

[bubba22]

How do you like the courses? Zelocity is very questionable. P3pro advancements and simulation is also questionable!

[ZMax]

The P3pro is fine as a swing analyzer but since it does not measure ball speed, ball launch angle, and ball path, don't expect it to be realistic. You can adjust all you want and it would never be accurate enough when playing the virtual courses. You can add the $3000 Vector plus the software but that will only get you ball LA, which doesn't make much sense.

[Stonebattle]

Hmmm, the P3pro has been very beneficial for me as a full swing analyzer. The adustments I've made to the config file produces good results that closely reflect that I see on the course. But, once I started playing the virtual course, well not so good. For example, the p3pro has no clue about a punch or flop shot, so ball info is critical for a simulator. As you point out.

[Stonebattle]

Bubba22
I thought I responded to your message before, but I must have hit the wrong button.
Anyway, the virtual courses are ok, but some shots just don't make sense. I find them frustrating at time.

It's interesting the results with I got with Zelocity turned out reasonable.

[Stonebattle]

Goatbarn
I read the Zelocity thread in hardware. wow, good call
I knew my carry numbers before I went in for the club fitting and Zelocity did get the swing speed, ball speed and carry numbers quite close, so I tended to believe the results. Difficult to explain how all three carry numbers came out so close. Luck?

[bubba22]

It is an eye opener for sure. Which Zelocity launch monitor did you use? The Zelocity probably measures ball speed and estimates carry fairly accurate. Its spin that is a total mystery.

[Stonebattle]

Bubba22
He said it was the latest model as of Dec, last year. That's all I know, but I could ask him if you want it?

[bubba22]

Just wondering if it is the Tracker or the PureLaunch or the Pureflight at that matter? here is there website to see what it looked like http://www.zelocity.com/golf/products.shtml If its none of these then its the Tracker http://zelocitytracker.com/I feel like its taboo to even post this!!!!!!!

[Stonebattle]

Bubba22
I'll ask, but it seems he may have had both the purelaunch and the pureflight.

[Stonebattle]

Bubba22
Purelaunch Pro

[golfun]

Stonebattle could you please tell me how the New P3Pro Courses play in your opinion? Like the plus and minuses.
Thanks!

[Stonebattle]

Golfun
I assume you are talking about the new virtual courses.
I should point out that all simulators have issues and these issues often require one to modify ones normal play and shots and I like my P3proswing.
To me it is often frustrating to play the virtual courses. Not so with P3proswings own courses. I've had a P3proswing for about 5 years now, but just now started playing the virtual courses.

In the virtual courses long shots are not to bad. The short game is a different story. The lack of ball info makes punch and flop shots impossible and sometimes those types of shots are needed. Putting seems difficult and often very hard to judge. One can find oneself three feet above the hole and 41 ft away and I at least can't putt the ball soft enough to keep the ball on the green. Of course, if I could putt I would be a scratch player. Chipping/pitching is also often difficult. I got in one situation where if I hit the ball soft it would not make the putting surface and if I hit it just a little harder it went over the green down into water. One can install one of the config file mods at the P3proswing support sight, but these seem to have unrealistic spin factors in many situations. We have a putting green inside our proshop. It has a stimp of about 11. I practiced a stroke that yielded an 11 foot putt. I tried the same stroke in the virtual course green and it went 20 ft. A stimp of 18? Some windage for sure. This can be adjusted, but why start so high. I'm a 3 handycap and my last 4 scores, in January if you can believe it, on a real course are 77, 72, 70 and 73. I have not broken 80 on the virtual courses. I can use one of the higher spin mods, and I will no doubt get better with further play, but I am interested in play and practice that helps me play golf on a real course better. I'm not looking for unrealistic play.

[golfun]

Stonebattle- So some of these issues can be fixed in the adjustable settings? For everything else- What does P3Pro need to fix software-wise?

Thanks for your input!!

[Stonebattle]

Good question Golfun
I'm not sure I can give you a good answer, but I will give it a shot.
I should give this more thought, but I wonder about the algorithm or software handshake between the P3proswing software and the virtual course software. The reason I'm thinking this is I don't see the same issues when playing the P3proswing courses. Also, when putting the ball seems to often bounce in an unusual way. This seems to result in an inconsistent translation of club speed to ball speed. I don't have any data to support that observation though. I would have to do quite a bit of experimentation to confirm that supposition. I know P3proswing does not support changes to the config file and I think that makes sense for a company position. Still, some changes to the config file may help, but it sounds like at least a couple of smart folks on this forum and P3proswing have already done quite a bit of this and I doubt I can improve on that.

P3proswing could do something about the red light. It seems I just get ready to putt, in the virtual courses, and the light goes off. Then I have to wait for it to comeback on again. Actually, I prefer the older unit that one had totrigger the putting mode.

[jimmyjames]

Just to add my thoughts to this post. I was on a simulator at our local golf shop. It is a high end simulator, although I am not sure what type. Anyway, after hitting on it for a little while, I went home and compared it to the proswing. Overall, the results for distance were very comparable. The lack of ball spin, however, caused the ball flight to be quite different, as expected. Still the end result of where the ball ended up was fairly close. In the end, I feel that the proswing gives an accurate enough picture to be useful to improve ones game.

As indicated above, putting is a different story. The putting is, simply put, awful! My experience mirrors that of stonebattle. I have not tried to adjust the setting yet, so I suppose it could be improved. Still, it should be much better out if the box. Btw, these opinons are based only on the new prem. courses.

[SFR]

Just to add my thoughts to this post. I was on a simulator at our local golf shop. It is a high end simulator, although I am not sure what type. Anyway, after hitting on it for a little while, I went home and compared it to the proswing. Overall, the results for distance were very comparable. The lack of ball spin, however, caused the ball flight to be quite different, as expected. Still the end result of where the ball ended up was fairly close. In the end, I feel that the proswing gives an accurate enough picture to be useful to improve ones game.

As indicated above, putting is a different story. The putting is, simply put, awful! My experience mirrors that of stonebattle. I have not tried to adjust the setting yet, so I suppose it could be improved. Still, it should be much better out if the box. Btw, these opinons are based only on the new prem. courses.

I assume you compared with the stock P3Pro file and not altered. You can adjust that spin on your own. Drag adj. will also help the ball flight. Only thing I am seeing weird is that a slow driver swing (70 mph) will generate 10 or 20 percent longer drive than it should, where as a swing that is about 100 mph is generating about right. This may be fixed when they come up with an update.

Putting is hard to judge but I guess when you talk about these PGA courses the greens are hard to read for real and harder to putt so add that to a sim and you have almost impossible to putt. Not every course is that hard. Some are better and not as sloaped as others. I tend to move the slider to 2 for the green friction so some courses are a bit slow but the harder ones are a bit easier to play. You may need to keep a record of what to play each course at. Some may be 1.8 and others at 2. Remember it's not so much that the greens are all fast but they are all sloaped so that you hit a ridge and once the ball crosses it, it runs down hill (as it would in real life) and off the green. An option for a bigger cup in the sim would help a bit as a lot will burn the edges and a sim should be adjustable for ones own desire. Auto put does help so you have one try at the putt and then after that its a gimme.

[Stonebattle]

Jimmyjames
I've tested this on more than one occation on an golf range and with the original p3proswing file, I found some clubs were close from a distance standpoint. Those were the 8,7,6 and maybe 5 iron. Others not so close, for example the driver seemed quite short while the pitching wedge was to long. I think the reason for the difference was the simulated loft and roll percent. For the driver, the carry distance was not bad, but the percent roll made the overall distance short. As far as the pitching wedge, mine is 51 degrees instead of 48 degrees as shown in the original config file. My pitching wedge normally does not roll forward by more than a yard and normally it stops or spins back a bit. The roll amount in the P3proswing is around 5 percent.
I also found the spread wider in real life than reported on the p3proswing, but the shot shape was reasonable for most types of shots. I change the values in the P3proswing config file to get the number closer to reality.

[p3prouser]

hey everyone,
i just bought a p3proswing plus the other week. i've been trying to adjust setting as such and now my big problem seems to be distance I hit the ball and swing speed. Distances I hit the ball seem to be 20+ yards shorter than real life results, even when using a club with the appropriate assumed loft in the software. I don't know what my swing speed in real life is, but in all my irons, swing speed ranges mid 50s to 61 mph.
Also, how can i find these modified config files and what are they really good for? I've already modified my environment to reduce reflection and it didn't seem to help, even taping my irons doesn't really help either.

Thanks for your help!

[Stonebattle]

Hi P3prouser
I find some of my club distances are close while others are well off. I find taping the clubs necessary to get reasonably consistant results. Making sure one gets the tape on straight and in the right location is key. I use a pair of calipers to make sure it's in the right place and tape over the reflective tape with clear tape.

The config file you are talking about is in your main hard drive under Program Files(sometimes X86)/SportsVision/P3Pro/P3p_config.
The first thing you need to do is make a copy of the file in another location, such as in a P3p folder in your documents file. You could also copy the file in the P3p folder and rename it. Careful, messing around in other files.

You can open the P3p_config file in notepad. The first one to look at is under ball controls. It's Ball_Distfactor.
Then go down the page unit you get to Distance scale. Change the other value, usually downward, until you get distances that reflect reality.
There are other things to change, but this is a good place to start. SFR is more of an expert than I am, so Hopefully he will chime in.

[p3prouser]

Thanks Stonebattle for the quick response.
I will try to adjust the config file tonight. How are you liking your p3proswing? Any regrets?

Hi P3prouser
I find some of my club distances are close while others are well off. I find taping the clubs necessary to get reasonably consistant results. Making sure one gets the tape on straight and in the right location is key. I use a pair of calipers to make sure it's in the right place and tape over the reflective tape with clear tape.

The config file you are talking about is in your main hard drive under Program Files(sometimes X86)/SportsVision/P3Pro/P3p_config.
The first thing you need to do is make a copy of the file in another location, such as in a P3p folder in your documents file. You could also copy the file in the P3p folder and rename it. Careful, messing around in other files.

You can open the P3p_config file in notepad. The first one to look at is under ball controls. It's Ball_Distfactor.
Then go down the page unit you get to Distance scale. Change the other value, usually downward, until you get distances that reflect reality.
There are other things to change, but this is a good place to start. SFR is more of an expert than I am, so Hopefully he will chime in.

[Stonebattle]

P3prouser
Hmmmm, tough question. For the price the P3Proswing is tough to beat. As a swing analyzer it's quite good and can take one a long way towards better play. Still, there's are a lot of issues with the software's interpretation of the effects the hit has on the ball. Meaning, the ball does not always react as the software would predict. Therefore it can take one only so far. Don't get me wrong, it's not bad for most full shots, although optimistic for spread.

As a simulator, it's not good. In this case their own courses are not bad, although once again optimistic. The interface with premium courses leaves much to be desired.

So, no I have no regrets, although if I had to start over, I would likely start with a different system.

[bubba22]

Well said Stonebattle. I dug my P3pro out last week for fun. The simulated games need a lot more work and as you say its not a great simulator. I just think that without a ball monitor for at least horizontal direction, launch and speed you will never get good accuracy. Spin measurement would be a bonus for sure. It's ok for club analysis but even that is not perfect.