I'm thinking about starting a little "side business"

[Kyle_B]

So I've been fixing/building custom clubs for a while now but mainly just my own. I was thinking about maybe spreading the word out to try and help people out that don't want to go to some large corporation *cough*GolfTown*cough* to have it done. I don't like sending my things in to large places like that as I find the people tend not to really care as much as you would if you were to do it.

I was just wondering if you guys (male/female) think there would be any market for that. I am always going to have my own tools and work on my own clubs, but would anyone else have any interest in having me either re-grip, re-shaft, remove broken shafts from hosel, and pretty much any other need you may have (both graphite and steel).

I know the prices are pretty low for this kind of thing so I'll have to try and work out some package deals or something. Any thoughts of if you would be interested in a "local" business that does this?

p.s. I'm not looking to make enough to buy a new car, just a little gas money for it or something.

[jeffc]

there are a few guys on here that do this kind of thing already. Depending on where you are located in Ottawa would help, since proximity is key and not having to drive across town to get a few grips done. I think if you kept the prices reasonable there would be room for another person doing this.

[Kyle_B]

Well I live in Kanata (right by the WavePool) and I wouldn't treat it as a second income so prices would be low. Any idea who else does this and how much they charge for services?

[jeffc]

The Saint, Chieflongtee, Downhillslider to name a few. As for prices, I don't really know off hand.

[Kona Golf]

Well I live in Kanata (right by the WavePool) and I wouldn't treat it as a second income so prices would be low. Any idea who else does this and how much they charge for services?

Hi Kyle,

Check the price board at Golftown to give you an idea on the various services and costs. Build your pricing from there. You do not have to be cheaper just offer a better service / value.

[downhillslider]

Have you thought about liability insurance, sole propritorship or incorporating your venture for buisiness registration and commercial taxes purposes just to name a few of the expenses that will come your way ?

All this and more as to be factored in to your pricing anf if you don't, you will loose $$ instead of putting gas in your car, unless, you are thinking of doing this underground witch would probably not be a good idea. There might be a few legitimate guys who might take offence to this and act accordingly.

Just some things to consider.

[Kyle_B]

Hi Kyle,

Check the price board at Golftown to give you an idea on the various services and costs. Build your pricing from there. You do not have to be cheaper just offer a better service / value.

I have already contacted them and they have pretty decent prices.

Have you thought about liability insurance, sole propritorship or incorporating your venture for buisiness registration and commercial taxes purposes just to name a few of the expenses that will come your way ?

All this and more as to be factored in to your pricing anf if you don't, you will loose $$ instead of putting gas in your car, unless, you are thinking of doing this underground witch would probably not be a good idea. There might be a few legitimate guys who might take offence to this and act accordingly.

Just some things to consider.

Only need to worry about being an official business if I make something like $35000/year (which I will not even come close to).

I would be doing it in my work office at my house. I have nothing to hide. I would just be doing something that I like doing to help out people that don't have the tools to do it themselves. I am a perfectionist so I won't be cutting corners or anything. Also, if I have to go pick up a part here and there, I won't mind having to drive. Like I said before, I'm not going to be doing it for the money. I would have to charge money to even out the cost of parts needed (like solutions, tapes, ferrules, and anything else that get's used up).

Bottom line is I'll always be fixing/making clubs for myself and my friends. If you don't want some guy working on clubs out of his house to work on your club, no biggy. I would understand someone feeling more comfortable to a big corporation.

[nokids]

I had a similar idea for detailing cars. I was so passionate about cleaning my car that I decided to do a little detailing on the side, for my friends, and their friends. Word got around that I was doing a good job and I was charging cheap rates, so I started getting a ton of requests. After a few months, I ended up hating the work, so I quit doing it.

I know fixing golf clubs and cleaning cars isn't the same thing, one is more phsycially demanding than the other, but I thought I'd share my little story nonetheless.

[Weazl]

Just remember anytime you are charging people and making money, its considered taxable income. I'm just sayin...

[Kilroy]

Only need to worry about being an official business if I make something like $35000/year (which I will not even come close to).

Really? You have to register your business in order to remit the HST. If you don't charge and remit the tax then your business is illegal. Where did you get the idea you can make $35,000 under the table legally?

[nokids]

http://sbinfocanada.about.com/od/tax...ess-Income.htm

explains it all.

[Kyle_B]

So you think that if I change a friend's oil in his car one time and charge him $10 to do so, I have to register a company to collect any income? No. There is a certain amount that one needs to make before the government sees them as a business. I had my numbers a little wrong, it's $30000 in 15 months. Anything less then that, and I'm just doing something for a few friends and not running a business.

Doesn't matter though. If you don't want me touching your clubs, then that's fine.

[Kilroy]

I had my numbers a little wrong, it's $30000 in 15 months.

Where are you getting that information? To my knowlege you have to collect & remit HST for any legal business transactions, and for that you need a business registration number.

Doesn't matter though. If you don't want me touching your clubs, then that's fine.

This aspect of the discussion has nothing to do with what goods or services you sell, it's about setting up a small business properly, no?

[Kyle_B]

Where are you getting that information? To my knowlege you have to collect & remit HST for any legal business transactions, and for that you need a business registration number

So you think that if I change a friend's oil in his car one time and charge him $10 to do so, I have to register a company to collect any income? No.

This aspect of the discussion has nothing to do with what goods or services you sell, it's about setting up a small business properly, no?

I'm just tired of having these "arguments". So if you think I'm doing something wrong, so be it. I'll spread some advertising out when I'm ready for "business". That is all.

[goochy]

You can run a small business as Kyle_B is proposing WITHOUT registering it as a business..BUT you do need to declare any for profit income as taxable income. If the income you declare is low so that your total taxable income is below a certain ammount (a number I am not sure of off hand) you will not be liable for income tax...if it is over that number..you will.

If you intend to name your business other than your own name (eg GolfCity), have a business partner, (eg Kyle_B and Associates) or if you business begins to make over a certain ammount then you do indeed need to register it.

If Kyle runs a very small operation doing this..as long as he declares the taxable income he has nothing to worry about at all...I dont know what Kyle's main source of income is but maybe he wont even cross the income tax threshold...but he does have to declare it on his T1. If its $10 of course no-one would declare it because your chances of getting caught are zero and the tax on it would be negligible...but if you start making a couple of grand...better decalre it...downhillslider is watching

[Kilroy]

I'm just tired of having these "arguments".

I was not accusing you of anything or arguing with you. There are lots of misconceptions when it comes to this stuff. I for example am confused by the notion that you could legally sell $30,000 over 15 moths without collecting any HST. I was hoping you'd enlighten me as to the source of that info since it's new to me. Goochy says you can to, but again no link to a gov site.

[nokids]

So you think that if I change a friend's oil in his car one time and charge him $10 to do so, I have to register a company to collect any income? No. There is a certain amount that one needs to make before the government sees them as a business. I had my numbers a little wrong, it's $30000 in 15 months. Anything less then that, and I'm just doing something for a few friends and not running a business.

Not sure if you're serious or seriously trolling us.



Question: I make a few bucks from my hobby. Do I have to declare this income?

Answer: Yes! The money you make from your hobby is considered to be business income. You may not consider that you actually run a business, but you do according to the government. The Canada Revenue Agency defines a business as "any activity that you do for profit".

They go on to say that the definition of business includes a profession, a calling, a trade, a manufacture, an adventure or concern in the way of trade, and an undertaking of any kind.
As you are selling a product or services you are definitely conducting an activity for profit. The Canada Revenue Agency doesn't care that you are only selling "a few" or that you consider your activity to be a hobby.

You must report the money you make from your hobby as business income by completing Form T2125, (Statement of Business or Professional Activities) which is included with the T1 income tax return package.

[John]

Good grief let the guy make a few bucks on the side, if you do something as a hobby and make a few grand a year from it more power to ya.

[GarthM]

Typically you do not need to register for GST/HST if you make less than 30K. HOWEVER you may also not collect GST/HST if you do not register, BUT if you make $30,001, you are liable for GST/HST on the entire amount. Given the current remittance rates in Ontario are 8.8% on the Quick Method, with the 1% deduction for the first 30K, you are looking at $2340, plus penalties and interest.

Also if you do not register, you may not claim input tax credits on GST/HST paid on supplies for the business.

Want a link??? Here's a link...not hard to find on CRA's site....

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/bsnss/tp.../menu-eng.html

[Kilroy]

Now that sounds like the CRA we know and love!

[nokids]

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/gncy/nvstgtns/ttw_tx-eng.html

[Chieflongtee]

30,000 grip changes in 15 months. That's 2000 grip changes a month if you charge a $1 per grip. No weekends and lots of sleepless nights.

How much $ a year can a fulltime clubmaker make in this neck of the woods.
I bet you won't see any of them driving cadillacs

[north52step]

scarey some of these comments, now me a few months later than the last post. For this small time stuff, who cares, do not understand the seriousness that some consider, ya ya ya Revenue Canada. Gosh I trade a few, sell a few, regrip a few, Gadoffi I am not (especially if I spelled it right). Keep trucking, and certainly agree with the likes of the Chief.

[bNeill]

Good grief let the guy make a few bucks on the side, if you do something as a hobby and make a few grand a year from it more power to ya.

This exactly. I mean if he's going to do this I would advertise via word of mouth and not make it super public, but revenue agencies won't waste resources on stuff like this.

I see no problem with it but you should probably be careful not to take business away from people on the forum who make their living from similar practices. The forum is a great resource and I wouldn't want to step on any toes as the golfing community is well connected.

[Weazl]

revenue agencies won't waste resources on stuff like this.

Wanna bet?

[bNeill]

Wanna bet?

If you provide information via internet forums and make it easy maybe, otherwise their resources are better spent tracking individuals, companies etc. that are trying to profit to a greater degree than to make "just a little gas money."

[Kilroy]

their resources are better spent tracking individuals, companies etc. that are trying to profit to a greater degree than to make "just a little gas money."

Popular misconception.

They audit 'red flag' returns for sure, but also a lot of random files. My daughter (20 at the time, working for a company and not making much) was asked to submit a bunch of reciepts to back her claims up. They would not have made much even if she had been cheating.

It's no fun being audited, but if your ducks are all in a row it's just a pain.

[Break68]

If you provide information via internet forums and make it easy maybe, otherwise their resources are better spent tracking individuals, companies etc. that are trying to profit to a greater degree than to make "just a little gas money."

You would be surprised. I have friends that work in Collections and Investigations at CRA and they will go after anyone for anything, even small stuff like this.
I have had thoughts of doing just what Kyle is talking about, but it is just not worth it. CRA is everywhere and they are watching. Ottawa is just too small to try and run a small business on the side and try and make a few bucks without registering the business name with Industry Canada, and registering with CRA for GST and HST.
Kyle, I applaud your initiative and attitude; just be careful.

[Weazl]

I bet if you took a poll, just on this forum, you'd be surprised how many people on this site work for CRA. I know many!

[gregnol]

now what if he took payment in cases of beer?