Chara hit

[jeffc]

I think Chara knew he was directing MP's body into the stanchion (not his head) but Chara has no way of knowing what the result of the play was going to be. MP could have put his arms out and lessened the impact to his head. The fault in this incident lies with the arena for having (6) dangerous stanchions, the NHL for not having a penalty for when a player pushes a guy into that dangerous area, Chara for deliberately trying to hurt MP by squeezing him into the dangerous area, and MP for not doing all he can to defend himself.

Chara should have been suspended a few games (3-5), just like Matt Cooke should have been suspended for hitting the Boston player in the head. But because there wasn't a rule at the time of the incident, the NHL gave no suspension. I think we'll see a rule change and hopefully a change in the design of the arena.

was reading today that the Habs players regularly steer away from that area because of the risks. Makes you wonder why Max decided to skate there, knowing Chara was there.

[jeffc]

close but no cigar, thats what u call rubbing someone out, gain body position and pinch him into the boards using body/shoulders, Smyth shoulder took 70% of the impact cause Johnson wasnt pushing on his head, or any part of his body. u dont push in hockey unless your trying to gain body position in front of the net not at fulll speed. All players need to be held accountable for their actions much like the NFL with their policy on headshots and facemask penalty's.

well, close enough in my opinion - the fact is the play is eerily similar.

[imozzie]

You're ignoring the fact that he should not have been hit at all because the puck was long gone. There is no doubt that Chara's penalty for interference was well-deserved, so you can't blame the victim this time.

There is no such thing as a rink without stanchions - there has to be a minimum of two to accommodate the player's benches. I do agree that the ones at centre ice should be eliminated and better padding should be used, but this kind of injury is always a possibility.

Not ignoring the fact that he was hit without the puck. Such is called 'Interference' and that call - the correct call was made.

Wrt not having a rink yet without such dangerous stanchions, this is exactly my point - but minimizing their potential danger is definitely doable with some engineering ingenuity. As per Kings GM Dean Lombarday in the Ottawa Sun today - "There are engineers who will tell you they can round the stanchions off as opposed to having a hard edge". He also will propose elimating player bench doorways at the GM meetings coming up. And Don Cherry has suggested that the glass at these locations should be angled 130+ degrees. All this in the attempt to keep players in the field of play as opposed to having the potential to fly out of it to a violent, or worse fatal, end.

[3Jack]

I've scanned the posts in this thread and I'm not sure if this has come up -- my apologies if it has -- but, regardless of intent, regardless of the positioning of the stanchions, the bottom line is that this was a HEAD SHOT. It doesn't matter that Chara is nine inches taller than the Montreal player, it's about being responsible, just as any player is responsible for his stick, even if he inadvertently nicks someone in the face -- it's still a penalty because you have to be responsible for your stick.

Why is it that the NHL has gone on and on about head shots this year (and last), but one of the worst head shots we've seen doesn't seem to be classified as one, and therefore wasnt' suspendable. Does anyone else find this as incongruous as I do?

[Break68]

I totally agree.

I've scanned the posts in this thread and I'm not sure if this has come up -- my apologies if it has -- but, regardless of intent, regardless of the positioning of the stanchions, the bottom line is that this was a HEAD SHOT. It doesn't matter that Chara is nine inches taller than the Montreal player, it's about being responsible, just as any player is responsible for his stick, even if he inadvertently nicks someone in the face -- it's still a penalty because you have to be responsible for your stick.

Why is it that the NHL has gone on and on about head shots this year (and last), but one of the worst head shots we've seen doesn't seem to be classified as one, and therefore wasnt' suspendable. Does anyone else find this as incongruous as I do?

[GoingLow]

Chara stated - "I did not intend to injure".....kinda believed him, they he stated in the same sentence, "I did not even realize it was Patch".....that is total BS and makes me question anything he says.....

He knew exactly where he was, patch touches the puck before the blue line, Chara directs him towards turnbuckle at red line and gives an extra push at the end....brutal....

Also doesn't help that Colin Campbell son plays on Boston.......

[jonf]

It was not a head shot though. Chara did not target or hit Pacioretty's head. The overhead view on this video shows clearly that Chara never makes contact with Pacioretty's head, which is why the NHL was unable to use its headshot rule.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jimZ1tSdPY0

[mberube]

if this happens anywhere else on the ice, its not an issue. It's unfortunate that it happened the way it did, but Chara can't be blamed for being big. Yes, it was an illegal play that caused an injury, and hence the game misconduct. But it was not the kind of hit that you can slap a huge suspension on. What if Chara dumps someone in a scrum by the side of the net, and they fall into the post? Is that suspendable?

This is getting a tonne of attention because of the focus on concussions. But, this was NOT a headshot. There is no rule in the NHL against causing a concussion. Obviously it's something that they want to limit, but there is no rule that states that any hit causing a concussion is a suspendable offense. You can debate the merits of adding such a rule, but the fact is, no such rule exists.

I understand the frustration of Habs fans, but unfortunate things happen on the ice. The NHL is in the unenviable position of having to make an unpopular decision - an unpopular decision that is nevertheless the CORRECT one.

From what I have read in the past, you have played hockey. Have you played competitively for a long time full contact? If I’m not mistaken you are a goalie but if you have played contact hockey for a long period of time can you honestly tell me that you have never had teammates deliberately take the opportunity to hit a competitor from the bench level on both ends of the bench so that he hits the corner glass? I have seen it and have heard some discussion after some of those hits where our D successfully executed such a play intentionally. There are hundreds of those hits on YouTube where you can see the intent. Chara new what he was doing IMO and when some of the best players in the league points out that you are aware of your surroundings, they know by experience.

[mberube]

Agree 100%. And Habs fans are going to be biased no matter what. Only Chara knows his intentions. To say otherwise is just plain ignorant. btw, this exact same play happened a few years ago - it was between Colorado and LA.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPphB84zMCM

does anyone remember it? I doubt it due to the teams involved. The NHL needs to deal with the problem that these stanchions are unsafe and potentially deadly. If Max has any beef it should be with the NHL.

There is a difference between both incidents. This incident was a clean shoulder hit. Chara clearly pushes with a high elbow. Did he want to kill him surely not but he did want him the feel it.

All I’m saying is that to start in was an interference call. That interference caused an injury. That should be an automatic minimum 1 game suspension. The same way a stick to the face in 2 minutes but a cut is an automatic 4 minutes. Then the player is on record.

[mberube]

The best reference to real fine consequences. Well said and totally agree.

[jeffc]

From what I have read in the past, you have played hockey. Have you played competitively for a long time full contact? If I’m not mistaken you are a goalie but if you have played contact hockey for a long period of time can you honestly tell me that you have never had teammates deliberately take the opportunity to hit a competitor from the bench level on both ends of the bench so that he hits the corner glass? I have seen it and have heard some discussion after some of those hits where our D successfully executed such a play intentionally. There are hundreds of those hits on YouTube where you can see the intent. Chara new what he was doing IMO and when some of the best players in the league points out that you are aware of your surroundings, they know by experience.

first of all only Chara knew what he was doing. Everything else is pure speculation. Secondly, regarding knowing your surroundings, MaxPac should have known them as well. I had read that Montreal players know that that area is one to avoid on the ice and routinely avoid going there. Furthermore, the commentator in the clip above indicates that it is a dangerous part of the ice. So what does MaxPac do? he skates towards that area knowing Chara is racing there too. I'm not blaming the victim here, but knowing your surroundings goes both ways.

[jeffc]

All I’m saying is that to start in was an interference call. That interference caused an injury. That should be an automatic minimum 1 game suspension. The same way a stick to the face in 2 minutes but a cut is an automatic 4 minutes. Then the player is on record.

The difference is one is actually a rule, the other is not. He did receive a 5 min and a game so in fact he was penalized. I'm not sure what a 1 game suspension would do. That being said, the NHL is all over the map with regards to suspensions and it would be nice to see some sort of guidelines for suspensions so they are not so subjective.

[mberube]

The difference is one is actually a rule, the other is not. He did receive a 5 min and a game so in fact he was penalized. I'm not sure what a 1 game suspension would do. That being said, the NHL is all over the map with regards to suspensions and it would be nice to see some sort of guidelines for suspensions so they are not so subjective.

A 1 or 2 game suspension would have at least made him or any other player responsible. This way nobody is satisfied. The Habs want more, the B’s fans want less. With no suspension it’s often settled on the ice with devastating results. Just like the Naslund, Bertuzzi, Moore incident. I’m not comparing the incidents because they are miles apart but it would be interesting to see the outcome if the NHL had suspended Moore for what he did to Naslund. Payback on the ice would have probably never taken place.

[jeffc]

A 1 or 2 game suspension would have at least made him or any other player responsible. This way nobody is satisfied. The Habs want more, the B’s fans want less. With no suspension it’s often settled on the ice with devastating results. Just like the Naslund, Bertuzzi, Moore incident. I’m not comparing the incidents because they are miles apart but it would be interesting to see the outcome if the NHL had suspended Moore for what he did to Naslund. Payback on the ice would have probably never taken place.

well I don't think 1-2 games would have made anyone happy and I don't think it was deserved. As for Bertuzzi, we can speculate all we want but we'll never know. I also didn't think a suspension was warranted for the hit on Naslund either. Naslund put himself in a vulnerable position and paid the price. Scott Stevens made a career out of those kinds of hits and everything thought he was a hero.

[justsomeguy]

first of all only Chara knew what he was doing. Everything else is pure speculation. Secondly, regarding knowing your surroundings, MaxPac should have known them as well. I had read that Montreal players know that that area is one to avoid on the ice and routinely avoid going there. Furthermore, the commentator in the clip above indicates that it is a dangerous part of the ice. So what does MaxPac do? he skates towards that area knowing Chara is racing there too. I'm not blaming the victim here, but knowing your surroundings goes both ways.

...except that he didn't "skate towards that area". When you watch the video you will see that the puck is about 10-20 feet away from "that area" and that is where both players are skating towards. It isn't until the puck is long gone that "the area" comes into play - hence the interference call.

[jeffc]

...except that he didn't "skate towards that area". When you watch the video you will see that the puck is about 10-20 feet away from "that area" and that is where both players are skating towards. It isn't until the puck is long gone that "the area" comes into play - hence the interference call.

The area being the area around the benches and he most certainly skated towards that area, I don't see how you could think otherwise?

[Wilster]

It was a deliberate hit , which unfortunately ended up in a terrible injury.
Had it had been Ovechkin or Crosby , guaranteed Chara would have been suspended.

[knickers]

It was a deliberate hit , which unfortunately ended up in a terrible injury.
Had it had been Ovechkin or Crosby , guaranteed Chara would have been suspended.

Haven't we seen two head shots on Crosby that went uncalled and unsuspended this year? Every hit is deliberate, but I have a very hard time believing Chara had all the thoughts from the previous games, knew who was skating towards him and just happened to have the perfect spot on the rink in that split second to deliver that hit in retribution. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Chara have a hold of MP a couple time in the last few games ? I'm pretty sure if he really wanted to hurt him he could have done so easily with his fists, stick or hit in other opportunities he had in that game or games before this incident. Just my opinion.

[habsfan]

Haven't we seen two head shots on Crosby that went uncalled and unsuspended this year? Every hit is deliberate, but I have a very hard time believing Chara had all the thoughts from the previous games, knew who was skating towards him and just happened to have the perfect spot on the rink in that split second to deliver that hit in retribution. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Chara have a hold of MP a couple time in the last few games ? I'm pretty sure if he really wanted to hurt him he could have done so easily with his fists, stick or hit in other opportunities he had in that game or games before this incident. Just my opinion.

Chara tried to pull Max out of a scrum and you could tell he was angry and was gonna rough up Max but a linesman noticed and helped him knowing he was in trouble. Then later that period he slashed Max to the back of the ankle he limped off and didn't come back till the next period, i'm pretty sure he knew what he was doing, those guys are too good not to.

[knickers]

Chara tried to pull Max out of a scrum and you could tell he was angry and was gonna rough up Max but a linesman noticed and helped him knowing he was in trouble. Then later that period he slashed Max to the back of the ankle he limped off and didn't come back till the next period, i'm pretty sure he knew what he was doing, those guys are too good not to.

Could it not be argued that Chara is also to good to chance any length of suspension with playoff positioning very much in play ? I mean if he can think in a split second of trying to hurt MP in that situation. I don't find it unreasonable that he could think of the possible consequences as well. We are talking about the captain of (arguably) a cup contender with no prior incidents in 13 years. As a Habs fan I'm not entirely surprised that you can't see both sides of this incident. Know one likes to see there players go down no matter how it happens.

[3Jack]

It was not a head shot though. Chara did not target or hit Pacioretty's head. The overhead view on this video shows clearly that Chara never makes contact with Pacioretty's head, which is why the NHL was unable to use its headshot rule.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jimZ1tSdPY0

If that's not a headshot, you have a very different definition of where someone's head is located on their person. It might not have been from the blindside as per the definition of the current headshot rule, but that's splitting hairs.

[Shivas Irons]

If that's not a headshot, you have a very different definition of where someone's head is located on their person.

So if Gary Bettman falls on his ass, that would basically be a headshot.

[jeffc]

So if Gary Bettman falls on his ass, that would basically be a headshot.

seeing that is where his brain is located, yes.

[habsfan]

Could it not be argued that Chara is also to good to chance any length of suspension with playoff positioning very much in play ? I mean if he can think in a split second of trying to hurt MP in that situation. I don't find it unreasonable that he could think of the possible consequences as well. We are talking about the captain of (arguably) a cup contender with no prior incidents in 13 years. As a Habs fan I'm not entirely surprised that you can't see both sides of this incident. Know one likes to see there players go down no matter how it happens.

when you watch every game and every play, its easier to see the big picture.

[jeffc]

when you watch every game and every play, its easier to see the big picture.

it's also easier to be incredibly biased and unobjective.

[leafman]

Haven't we seen two head shots on Crosby that went uncalled and unsuspended this year? Every hit is deliberate, but I have a very hard time believing Chara had all the thoughts from the previous games, knew who was skating towards him and just happened to have the perfect spot on the rink in that split second to deliver that hit in retribution. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Chara have a hold of MP a couple time in the last few games ? I'm pretty sure if he really wanted to hurt him he could have done so easily with his fists, stick or hit in other opportunities he had in that game or games before this incident. Just my opinion.

Sorry to get off topic a little but the Steckle hit on Crosby was all Crosby's fault. Talk about falling asleep at the wheel, he turned his head looking over his shoulder to follow the puck and skated into Steckle. For the league's best player to do something that dumb is unreal imo.

[habsfan]

it's also easier to be incredibly biased and unobjective.

emotionally attached yes, its not just habs fans saying this was deliberate, there's a variety of opinions on this matter and the way you shoot everyone's opinion down it sounds like you knew for sure Chara had no malicious intent.

[jeffc]

emotionally attached yes, its not just habs fans saying this was deliberate, there's a variety of opinions on this matter and the way you shoot everyone's opinion down it sounds like you knew for sure Chara had no malicious intent.

I haven't met a Habs fan yet that isn't calling for Chara's head or that can look at this objectively - am I surprised by that - likely no, since Habs fans are obviously very passionate. I'm not shooting down everyone's opinion, I am simply stating that only Chara know's for sure of his intent - everyone against him seems to be able to read his mind. I have no idea what his intent was, nor does anyone else for that matter but people keep saying they do.

Hey, if it were Alfie on the end of that check I'd be ** too, and it would possibly skew my view of the situation. As it stands, I have no vested interest in any of this, just a hockey fan. Habs fans should be mad at the owners, for having a rink that has the potential to cause that type of injury whether or not it was intentional or not and at the NHL for not doing more to provide a safer environment for their players.

[habsfan]

I haven't met a Habs fan yet that isn't calling for Chara's head or that can look at this objectively - am I surprised by that - likely no, since Habs fans are obviously very passionate. I'm not shooting down everyone's opinion, I am simply stating that only Chara know's for sure of his intent - everyone against him seems to be able to read his mind. I have no idea what his intent was, nor does anyone else for that matter but people keep saying they do.

Hey, if it were Alfie on the end of that check I'd be ** too, and it would possibly skew my view of the situation. As it stands, I have no vested interest in any of this, just a hockey fan. Habs fans should be mad at the owners, for having a rink that has the potential to cause that type of injury whether or not it was intentional or not and at the NHL for not doing more to provide a safer environment for their players.

Montreal applied to have the boards changed in December but have yet to receive the OK from the NHL, per Geoff Molson.

[knickers]

Sorry to get off topic a little but the Steckle hit on Crosby was all Crosby's fault. Talk about falling asleep at the wheel, he turned his head looking over his shoulder to follow the puck and skated into Steckle. For the league's best player to do something that dumb is unreal imo.

No argument here. You would find an argument from others though. I'm only replying to the comment that the league would have suspended Chara had it been Crosby or Ovechkin. It was pure speculation and is an easy cop out argument I hear every time a "questionable" play occurs.