Kaymer: Woods deserves more respect

[Eagle_Hunter]

I am very realistic when it comes to Tiger Woods. I don't think he is a saint and I don't think everything he does is necessarily to better golf. I hate the fact that he swears and throws clubs etc. He is not the only one to do it. In a perfect world he would be a great guy off the course and never do anything wrong, but he's not perfect. Just like every human.

What has he done for golf that is negative? Throw a club - that's been done before him. Swear - That's been done before him. Other than that, his cheating has nothing to do with the game of golf. Professionalism has nothing to do with it either, he wasn't cheating on the course was he?

Positives -

-Viewers
-Donations
-Inspire kids to golf
-Challenge competitors and make them work harder
-Help change the view that golfers aren't fit or athletes.

Whether you like him or not he has changed the face of golf and opened a lot of eyes! Has taken golf to a more sporty level.

BC Mist - I understand where you are coming from with the antics but just because you think he is a phony doesn't mean he hasn't given back in more ways than one.

[TLB]

I've said it before and will repeat it again: professional golf was very much alive & well before TW and will continue to prosper after he's gone ...

[BC MIST]

-Viewers
-Donations
-Inspire kids to golf
-Challenge competitors and make them work harder
-Help change the view that golfers aren't fit or athletes.

Of your five "positives," only the second is valid as the rest are incidental.

I wonder how much of the absurd $3,200,000 show-up fee from Dubai is going to be used advance the game of golf. Maybe it's just his monthly payment to Elin.

[BC MIST]

I'm sure if you looked at who has invested the most money in golf development in the US, he would be among the leaders. Be it through financial donations, or the establishment of his foundation, or the donation of his time - he has to be in the top five of all time in this difficult-to-quanitify area.

IF he has done what you suggest, then good for him. Maybe signing a few autographs at tournament sites and exchanging a kind word and a smile with a youngster, might be better for golf advancement than anything. Costs nothing to boot.

[stevek]

IF he has done what you suggest, then good for him. Maybe signing a few autographs at tournament sites and exchanging a kind word and a smile with a youngster, might be better for golf advancement than anything. Costs nothing to boot.

Wasn't revelations of him doing that with his neighbours 17yo daughter the last straw for his marriage?

[leftylucas]

I disagree that he is a good role model for golf, a work ethic in itself does not make a role model. Kids hear about his hard work but they see him throw clubs, swear, have temper tantrums and ignore the gallery at tournaments end. I fully understand that he is not the only one doing this kind of thing but those have a negative impact on his ability to be a role model. As for being a cry baby like Gretz or Crosby, sure, but not being the only one doing it does not make it right.

A poor sport, not sure, his competitive nature overshadows good intentions he has there. When he was 12 and lost to the club pro he refused to shake the pro's hand after the match. His mother made him walk home with his clubs so I am sure he is not that bad now. He is well liked by his fellow players so I would say that at least they think he is a good sport.

Respect outside of the clubhouse is really a question of morals and no one can dictate that since his life is so public and he is at the root of the fallout, no matter what he has done for golf!

[Gropper]

From twitter

Nike's @TigerWoods finishes up his 1st rd at Dubai Desert Classic&conducts a clinic for young golf athletes
http://plixi.com/p/76202410

Nope never does nothing!!

[leftylucas]

Give me a break, this is a Nike sponsored event. No matter how you cut it his moral misconduct will take more than a personal appearance written into a contract to make him man of the year!

[sensfan63]

carefully crafted "Man of honour" personna .

I have yet to see any evidence provided of this so-called persona.

Just because you hawk razorblades doesn't mean you're telling everyone you are honorable while doing so.

[Gropper]

Hey's still doing it and i bet all the other clinics run by all other players are sponsored and part of a contract. Not saying hes man of the year. But he is out there doing things!

[leftylucas]

Wow, really, this is about him getting respect, he has to earn it. He is getting paid to be there, dont forgot that. Your right every player makes appearance for their sponsors but remember he said he was going to change, approach life differently, be more approachable, I have seen ZERO evidence of that this past year. he is the same self-absorbed person, and your right you can probably add a bunch of other overpaid PGAers in there as well. Mickleson is not well liked by his peers but he is out there signing his name and talking with people for hours after a tournament. That is likely not 100 per cent genuine but at least it is more than a paid appearance.

[Gropper]

Once again, there were pics of him at Torrey Pines last week signing autographs for the kids after his round. Just cause you dont see it, dosn't mean it dosn't happen.

if people respect him or not means nothing to me. But when people say he has done nothing for the game is when i think they are being a little ridiculous. He has earned the respect for what he has done in golf and for golf and thats what this discussion is about. Not about him as a person. He obvislouy is not a perferct person and has screwed up big time in other areas in his life.

[btasse]

I think this article "sums" it up....... Look at Tiger in first pic......

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/gol...t-Classic.html

[leftylucas]

No, this discussion is about giving him more respect because of what he has done for golf but I guess we are supposed to completly ignore the damage he has caused to it as well. Its an old saying give props when deserved but dont when it is not. He spewed a lot of rhetoric before his comeback, unfortunately it seems it was just that. Can you imagine had he done the things he said he was going to do, that would have made a difference to a lot of opinions on this thread, including mine. I agreee that he has done more for golf directly or otherwise, don't get me wrong, it does not give him a position of preference in the respect department.

[Break68]

I think this article sums it up....... Look at Tiger in first pic......

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/gol...t-Classic.html

Nice article, I love it, Tiger just going through the motions in Dubai!

[BC MIST]

From twitter

Nike's @TigerWoods finishes up his 1st rd at Dubai Desert Classic&conducts a clinic for young golf athletes
http://plixi.com/p/76202410

Nope never does nothing!!

For $3,200,000, you would probably agree to do a clinic, too. When he does this stuff out of the goodness of his heart, I'll eat some of my previous words.

[Break68]

This will stir the pot some more:

Truth & Rumors: Tiger reportedly paid $55.4 million for Dubai project

Posted at 11:21 AM by Jeff Ritter | Categories: AT&T Pebble Beach National Pro-Am, Pebble Beach, Tiger Woods, Tim Finchem, Truth & Rumors
When Tiger Woods travels to Dubai, it's about more than winning a golf tournament -- it's business time. In addition to receiving multi-million dollar appearance fees for competing in the desert, Woods also spearheaded a (stalled) Dubai golf project. Terms of that deal, struck in 2008, were never made public, but Arabian Business Magazine has a new report on the numbers, and they are staggering:

Tiger Woods received $55.4m from UAE developer Tatweer to promote a golf resort in Dubai, just 24 days before the collapse of Lehman Brothers in 2008.
Documents seen by Arabian Business reveal that Woods was originally paid $26,250,000 to promote the Tiger Woods Dubai resort, following a contract first signed on 20 June 2006.
However, on 22 August 2008, both Woods and Tatweer signed an “Amendment to Golf Course Design and License Agreement” which contained 15 new clauses.
On top of the $26,250,000 already paid to Woods' company ETW (Eldrick Tiger Woods), the new deal stated that ETW would be paid "the sum of $70m as a promotional fee".
The document broke down the extra payments as:
* $26,166,177 would be paid to ETW within ten days of the agreement being signed.
* $14,583,333 would be paid to ETW within ten days of Woods appearing at the official opening of Tiger Woods Dubai.
In addition, the new deal stated that Woods would no longer receive a villa on the resort, but “the Parties hereto agree to keep confidential the fact that ETW has agreed to waive its right to receive the Chosen Development Unit.”
In total, the potential value of the new deal was worth $98.8m to Woods – more than the $92.2m he had earned in prize money up to 2008.

Not sure what's more shocking: the cash Woods raked in from this project, or the fact that he wasn't able to get himself a free condo in the deal.



Read more: http://blogs.golf.com/presstent/2011...#ixzz1DaXs1whv

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I am in the wrong line of work, Tiger is all about the $$$$$$.
$3.2 Million for a few rounds of golf and a kid's clinic, wow, I am touched. What a kind hearted guy Tiger is.

[Gropper]

I just find it sad that some people can spend this much time hating some one.....sure hope your kids never screw up. I am done in this thread, if he does something good its cause he got paid, just cant win, as people have stated it gets old when the haters do nothing but hate.

[sensfan63]

Nice article, I love it, Tiger just going through the motions in Dubai!

What does that mean, going throught the motions? Other than the article heading, what part of the article points to "going through the motions?"

More BS, from a British tabloid by the way. Wonderful journalism.

"Oh no, he doesn't give me the answers that *I* want! "

You guys are really quite something. Is it jealousy? Is it seriously that you can't stand someone doing well that doesn't fit your mold of what you want to see?

How very juvenile.

[sensfan63]

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I am in the wrong line of work, Tiger is all about the $$$$$$.
$3.2 Million for a few rounds of golf and a kid's clinic, wow, I am touched. What a kind hearted guy Tiger is.

By the way, Steve Stricker cashed $2 million for his appearance last week in Bahrain.

Is he now on your list?

[Break68]

I don't hate Tiger, I find him amusing and I find it amusing how much people think he is wonderful and such a great person.

[BC MIST]

By the way, Steve Stricker cashed $2 million for his appearance last week in Bahrain. Is he now on your list?

When it becomes only about the money, yes. Still like his swing, though.

[HoganWoods]

As much as I like watching Tiger play, he is no role model. I would not try and get my children to idolize him. I'm not sure what Kaymer means when he says Tiger gets more respect, maybe I need to listen to the actual clip.

One thing though, Tiger Woods as done as much for Golf and its progression as any other Pro Golfer in the history of this game, including Arnold Palmer.

[Colby]

I just find it sad that some people can spend this much time hating some one.....sure hope your kids never screw up. I am done in this thread, if he does something good its cause he got paid, just cant win, as people have stated it gets old when the haters do nothing but hate.

It's not about hate, it's about respect. And I don't spend anytime thinking about Tiger except when I see these threads and posts about him.

And goodness should come from the heart, not because you are being paid for it. I'm sure that if Canadian Blood Services paid people for blood, more people would do it. However it is called a donation, and it is done out of the goodness of someone, not because it will get them anything. Tiger being paid over 3 million to show up for a golf tournament (and it's the last year of a 4 year deal, so every other year was also a paid appearance fee), with no contract, will he be back to Dubai if there is a tournament?

It's really the agents who are to blame for most of the issue around appearances and such as they get a cut of everything. However Tiger should have the balls to tell them to go away when they tell him (and Mike Weir) things like don't sign pictures of Tiger putting the Green Jacket on you.

As I have said before, I can appreciate his skill, however I cannot respect the man given what I have seen in person, and what I have seen covered in the media. Until I see that change, until Tiger can do something out of the goodness of his heart (and once doesn't make him a changed man, it has to become his lifestyle), then I will not be changing my feelings on this.

[mpare]

You may be right, but in light of the numbers to which I made reference in post #19 I suspect that you are very wrong. What data exists to support your assertion?

...
One thing though, Tiger Woods as done as much for Golf and its progression as any other Pro Golfer in the history of this game, including Arnold Palmer.

[HoganWoods]

Just my point of view. Ask any person on the planet to name a golfer and you'll get Tiger Woods 90 percent of the time. I wonder if you asked the same question 30-40 years ago if you'd even get any response at all. He's brought the game up a few notches...again in my opinion.

The question I ask you though is: if he hasn't done as much as anyone for the game, name me others who have done more.

[Kilroy]

You may be right, but in light of the numbers to which I made reference in post #19 I suspect that you are very wrong. What data exists to support your assertion?

If he hasn't done as much as anyone for the game, name me others who have done more.

That is not even a feeble attempt at an answer. Deflection is no way to debate.

[mpare]

Arnold Palmer's name recognition is at least equal to, if not greater than, Tiger's. More importantly there is a verifiable correlation between the increase in the number of golfers and his presence as a golfing force. Finally, his contribution to growing a love and respect for the game is unequaled.

I saw Arnie play at the Senior PGA Championship a few years ago. It was clear that he was not feeling well. Notwithstanding that, after his first round he spent more than an hour signing autographs and speaking with the fans. He loved them and they reciprocated that love. That is a man who deserves respect.

Just my point of view. Ask any person on the planet to name a golfer and you'll get Tiger Woods 90 percent of the time. I wonder if you asked the same question 30-40 years ago if you'd even get any response at all. He's brought the game up a few notches...again in my opinion.

The question I ask you though is: if he hasn't done as much as anyone for the game, name me others who have done more.

[sensfan63]

Arnold Palmer's name recognition is at least equal to, if not greater than, Tiger's. More importantly there is a verifiable correlation between the increase in the number of golfers and his presence as a golfing force. Finally, his contribution to growing a love and respect for the game is unequaled.

I saw Arnie play at the Senior PGA Championship a few years ago. It was clear that he was not feeling well. Notwithstanding that, after his first round he spent more than an hour signing autographs and speaking with the fans. He loved them and they reciprocated that love. That is a man who deserves respect.

Who was fawning over him, though? Did you see any 14 and 15 year olds? I doubt it. You're talking about the people that are >50 years old for Palmer to have that effect on.

I'm 33, and never in my golf-watching has Arnold Palmer been relevant as a player. Take that fact, and extend it to people who don't play golf and are simply fans. How many golfers under 40 really know, understand, and appreciate what Arnold Palmer brought to the game? I know I don't, mostly because I wasn't alive when Palmer was at his peak. You want to know what I remember Palmer for? Advocating that the general public play clubs that weren't conforming to the Rules of Golf.

[spackler]

Arnold Palmer's name recognition is at least equal to, if not greater than, Tiger's. More importantly there is a verifiable correlation between the increase in the number of golfers and his presence as a golfing force.

Not to be a pedant, but unless you have strong evidence that people took up the game because of Arnold Palmer, that evidence is coincidental not correlational. The rise of golf in the 50s also coincided with a post-war economic boom where an expanded middle class had a great deal more discretionary income. Golf expands and contracts with the economy. Period.