Corporate memberships questions

[Chieflongtee]

Do Corporate memberships have to put the $ up front when buying upcoming memberships for the upcoming season?

If so that is a lot of money to put up in November/December

For example: 100 memberships x $1000( or more or less)= $100,000

I have heard that these memberships cost more than a regular membership. True or not?

If so why the restrictions?

[Kilroy]

I can't get into specifics, but I can respond to these questions in general terms.

Do Corporate memberships have to put the $ up front when buying upcoming memberships for the upcoming season?

For the most part, yes.

If so that is a lot of money to put up in November/December
For example: 100 memberships x $1000( or more or less)= $100,000

They are much more than $1000 / yr

I have heard that these memberships cost more than a regular membership. True or not?

Yes ... see above.

If so why the restrictions?

That's the deal if you want the course in your coral. Take it or leave it. They are all individual businesses and there is no standard deal.

[TLB]

Very interesting Kilroy, and thanks for sharing this info with us. I have often wondered what the deal is from the association perspective.

[Chieflongtee]

They are much more than $1000 / yr

Wow. That is some kind of yearly mortgage

That's the deal if you want the course in your coral. Take it or leave it. They are all individual businesses and there is no standard deal.

Just stating an opinion here but it seems to me that if you all got together and put pressure maybe some would review their position. After all you are buying memberships and your $ are just as good as the regular golf pig member who plays every day. Moreover oftentimes members of the foursome are not all corporate members and bring along a friend who pays the full price. Let's not forget additional revenues such as pro shop purchases, food. drinks. range balls etc..

If let's say you all went to one club that has 40 of these memberships combined and told them that you are not to renew because of restrictions I believe they might review their position unless they are willing to give up close to $50,000 of annual income for years to come and especially if that money has to be put up in December.

[Kilroy]

Yah. Good luck with that.

They are not going to to be strong-armed into removing restrictions. If we don't want to buy what is offered that's OK. They will only make a deal that works for them, and we will only make a deal that works for us. If we refused to buy courses with restrictions we'd have less courses. It would not result in them caving.

[Chieflongtee]

If we refused to buy courses with restrictions we'd have less courses.

True but you could probably buy more at other courses that are more open minded or rather more income conscious.that si very good cash flow on an annual basis. Moreover and I speak for myself I will not play any of the courses with after 12 restriction unless it's a special occasion or one of the last games in the fall. To each his own and I don't have the stats but I am pretty sure I am not the exception to the rule.

If they have restrictions why would you guys pay more for a regular membership? They are charging you more for non prime time spots. A couple years back one particular club put up a weekend restriction after 12. They quickly realised that the spots were not getting filled and that you guys were not going to buy as many memberships the following year. I believe they caved in as they at leat modified the restrictions to before 9 and after 12.

Some have reasonable restrictions. Take the Marshes for example. Before 10h30 and after 2( 7 days a week).

[Kilroy]

If they have restrictions why would you guys pay more for a regular membership?

These are not "regular memberships". Regular memberships are not transferable. Only the owner of the membership can use it. With a "Corporate Membership" anyone authorised by the owner of the membership can use it. That's where these programs fit in.

I'd love to call all the shots with them, but that's just not going to happen.

There will always be a "catch" with discount programs like these. Otherwise why would anyone ever pay full green fees? If you can accept the compromises and play your golf within these programs limitations they are great. If it's not a good fit, then join a course that will better accomodate your needs.

[Brewcee]

The prime time slots that are filled by green fee players every day bring in more money per round than coporate membership players. Leaving prime time slots for green fee players is higher risk, higher reward. Also their own members will take these slots too, so they feel as though they have it covered and do not see the benefit of giving these slots up to discount players.

Also, many courses are starting to focus on the return customer. The guy or girl who plays the same course all time, plays enough to get their money's worth of a membership, but still pays green fees. Many (if not most?) coporate golf members are golfing nomads, they play a different course each week and maybe go back to the same course 5 times in a year. This isn't necessarily the courses target audience, so why cater to them.

[big mac]

I'm not exactly sure on this but I was under the impression that some corporate memberships were more expensive than ordinary memberships because a corporate membership INCLUDES 4 T-Times not 1

As an example; if a corp membership cost 2500.00 and your season was a good 5 months-that means the maximum dollar income would be 150 rounds x 20.00 per----less rain days, tounaments etc--say 10%. That leaves a profit of 200.00 for a 2500.00 investment. Now say the same corp membership was 5000.00 with 4 T-Times------now that's a whole different ball game !!!!!!!!

Personally I would not be playing golf if it was not for the discount clubs----they DO fill a need---if there was no need they would not be in business. I played 75 games this year-half with EG and the other half with specials---Red Book and the odd coupon. I think if I remember correctly I spent a total of 1800.00 over 6 months or an average of 24.00 per round or 300.00 per month--that's pretty good value for dollar.

[Kilroy]

I'm not exactly sure on this but I was under the impression that some corporate memberships were more expensive than ordinary memberships because a corporate membership INCLUDES 4 T-Times not 1

You can generally purchase as many spots as you want. As I explained, they are more expensive because they are transferable. Lets say you wanted to share a membership with a friend. You could both play, but only one of you on any given day. You'd expect higher than average usage from that membership so it's sold at a premium.

[Sakuraba]

I know a guy who bought a membership at my course and played 3 times that year. Compare that to one of the discounted memberships that is used virtually every day.

As a long-time member of a course I am glad that we are not oversubscribed by these memberships. I would be extra-keen to keep them restricted away from the coveted Saturday and Sunday morning times also. Just a little devil's advocate here, no offense intended.

[jeffc]

I know a guy who bought a membership at my course and played 3 times that year. Compare that to one of the discounted memberships that is used virtually every day.

As a long-time member of a course I am glad that we are not oversubscribed by these memberships. I would be extra-keen to keep them restricted away from the coveted Saturday and Sunday morning times also. Just a little devil's advocate here, no offense intended.

while you might say that, these memberships are likely providing much needed revenue to your club that without them, could result in higher fees for you. In the end, if you don't want these, they fully private is the way to go. no offense of course

[Chieflongtee]

while you might say that, these memberships are likely providing much needed revenue to your club that without them, could result in higher fees for you. In the end, if you don't want these, they fully private is the way to go. no offense of course

Now. That's funny and very true. But the fully private has its own surprises.A friend of mine and his buddies got lured into joining a fully private course. At the end of the year they had to spit out an extra $700 because the club did not meet its budget. The following year the club increased the membership by another $500 with the year end clause still in effect

At that same club the guest rate is $70 after 4 O'clock and the same rate applies even in November. I am sure they would do better financially if they softened it a little. Beautiful track imho but f it I'd rather pay 4 rounds elsewhere using a corporate membership. But it seems that the tail is wagging the dog

[Chieflongtee]

I know a guy who bought a membership at my course and played 3 times that year. Compare that to one of the discounted memberships that is used virtually every day.

.

Unless he joined for social reasons, or had an injury which prevented him from playing
more often or unless he doesn't give a crap about $ he would be much better off just paying as he goes. It's plain madness

[Sakuraba]

Unless he joined for social reasons, or had an injury which prevented him from playing
more often or unless he doesn't give a crap about $ he would be much better off just paying as he goes. It's plain madness

he joined for cheap (there was a new member incentive at the time) and then his wife got pregnant with an unexpected 3rd child... but still... He sure didn't buy one the following year. In reality, those corporate spots have never really hindered me from getting the time I want as far as I know, and I suspect jeff is right, they provide a nice boost for the course.