P3pro Launch Monitor and GSA!!!

[bubba22]

Thanks psace. I am still very happy with the courses. I just hope that they add the launch given that it works great with their original software. I am optimistic that it will fly. I too would love to have a vector or zelocity integration, but at that price I would probably opt for the Pro7 or the GC2.

[psace]

GC2 for me Bubba, all the way. I would love to hit off of the divot action mat instead of the sensor pads we have now. Why the hell can't I win the damn lottery!

[bubba22]

I hear ya psace. The GC2 would be awesome. Certainly not cheap if you look at the cost of the unit and the courses. Benefit of hitting of of different surfaces is extremely awesome.

[readygolf]

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[bubba22]

Sure you can debate how much data is needed for simulation. Most high end simulators are essentially launch monitors. I draw my limit at knowing at least the launch. There is nothing more frustrating than hitting a thin shot and seeing a perfect launch and golf shot on the sim. There are some people who must have a ball sensor as well as a method of determining spin for their sim. Everybody has to decide what they want. To be frank at the price of the p3pro, I would put the ST1 and GGS systems as serious contenders.

[rdh]

The affordable launch angle add-on was one differentiator between the P3Pro and the ST-1. I'm surprised not many people have bought the launch angle add-on...I would have thought it would be a popular item. If P3Pro drops it, then in my mind it closes the gap with the ST-1.

[bubba22]

My exact point rdh. In speaking with different sim companies, there will be a push towards developing an affordable package that includes launch. I know Protee and GGS systems are on that path. ProTee said they are in the process of developing a webcam launch add on similair to the P3pro. Martin at GGS said he is developing a new pad with the vx launch add on at a price of about $2400. Who knows what will get done and what is all talk. I can tell you that if the ST1 had a launch add on, I would definitely have gone that route. For now I will wait and see. I think the price rane in the 2-3 range with launch is very doable. I do think it is a big mistake by P3pro to drop and not expand the launch option as you say rdh.

[netcam]

I agree RDH!

I just purchased my P3Pro about two weeks ago and when I called P3 asking questions about the launch the guy was almost trying to talk me out of it saying no one really gets that but club fitters and in was surprised to hear that.

[bubba22]

It really is too bad hearing that. Mark my words other conpanies will develop a sim that has launch in the same price range as the p3pro and will sell very well. They should take advantage of the launch add on feature that they currently have. Just my 2 cents.We'll just have to wait and see.

[dvshx]

I will call Jay Russo directly and get some clarification about this.

[bubba22]

Do let us know dvshx.

[dvshx]

I spoke to Jay Russo to discuss their plans with the Launch Angle add-on. He clarified that they never intended for it to work with the 37 courses. There were several complaints about the Launch Angle not being consistent, but we all know that it is due to user error. Once you got the camera in the perfect spot, the readings are accurate. They ARE NOT dumping this feature for good. It is possible that they may "semi-discontinue" it while making improvements to the design, just like what they did with the courses. Just like what Cory said, they are also focusing on integrating P3Pro with other products like Zelocity and etc.

[bubba22]

Thanks dvshx. Sounds hopeful. I have put the launch angle sensors through the pace over the last 8 months. I have had lots of discussions with Chuck, their technical expert, who has been very helpful. I have been testing it with the vector Accusport launch monitor and with several key changes it works absolutely perfect.

The key things that are needed for improved accurasy are 1) Good webcam that can capture the 30 fps limit. I have found that the Sony PS3 eye webcam has great performance and software that will allow for direct settings to the 30 fps. Otherwise with the Logitech you need to play with the gain and exposure to get that frame rate and even then you have no idea what the frame rate really is. 2) More light- a cheap 5 dollar light that is shining just ahead of the ball to allow for the ball flight to be captured. I think having their supplied light on the ball is also important but having light ahead of the ball where the ball will be captured is very critical. Without that my launch results were not as consistent 3) Set up as per their suggestions in the manual. Everything should be checked so the position is maintained as if not then there may be errors. Certainly Chuck and I have had lots of discussions and emails on the subject. I do think it is critical to have a small launch angle video to check that the position is maintained and the lines are consistent. This doesn't happen often but if the camera is moved or hit by a flying ball then it may shift. I have even made a small cardboard housing to protect it. All in all very easy and user friendly and truly the poor man's way of showing with good accuracy launch of the ball.

I truly wish they would reconsider this option. I will contact Chuck about working with them on the setup if possible.

[bubba22]

I do certainly hope that there integration with the Zelocity/Vector or what ever launch monitor is successful. It probably is more important for teaching pros/commercial venues or the really avid home user that has that cash. I think the webcam launch should be marketed to the home user that wants that extra add on for launch at a much lower pricepoint. I am sure that a lot of home users would bite the bullet at some point to know the launch angle if that feature is available especially for the simulation courses. For now I absolutely love it for the driving range in the original p3pro courses. I really think that the graphics of the new courses are much better and more suited for launch distinction.

[bubba22]

I do wonder how close they are with the Vector integration. It certainly would be nice if the p3pro folks would decide about the future of the webcam launch angle add on and let buyers know whether the launch add on will continue and be incorporated with the new virtual GSA courses.

[Par2Pro]

Hey Bubba,

As far as I know, they are not going to discontinue their Launch Angle option, but they want to give users the option to integrate with other systems. They currently have the integration with the Zelocity PureLaunch monitor and I think that they are just trying to offer another integration with a system that is a little more cost effective.

[bubba22]

Those who are interested in launch angle should know that the webcam sim is very accurate. I have been testing the accuracy with the Accusport Vector and it is extremely good. Those looking for more accuracy should be encouraged to look at this add on for sure. PM me if you want any further details or instructions on its setup.

Without the launch the new courses are fantastic for sure. I wouldn't want anyone to think that the new virtual courses are not good. I would certainly recommend the courses. I am just suprised that they have not included the launch or Zelocity integration with the new courses as these are integrated with their original driving range and 2 core courses. Hopefully once they work on their Vector integration they will consider incorporating the launch features with their new GSA courses.

[readygolf]

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[bubba22]

Where are you getting the information from readygolf? There are others that have said that the launch feature will not be discontinued. Are you getting the info from the p3pro folks?

I have hit about 2 thousand balls with the LA feature set up with the vector as a check and can tell you that it registers about 100% of the time and is within a degree or 2 from the vector. That is accurate enough for me. I have no idea about the Zelocity but I don't understand the purpose of the integration if the ball flight is not altered in the p3 program.

readygolf do you have the p3pro and the virtual courses?

[readygolf]

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[bubba22]

Interesting. Do you speak with Jay Rosso often? Is this launch unit a high speed camera? Will it work with the virtual courses? Will it measure ball speed and direction? Any idea when it will be ready? Those of us with the old launch device have wasted our money then. That's too bad. Great if they do come up with another device.

[bubba22]

readygolf it would be nice if you could elaborate on the information you have.

It is good news that they are looking at a design change to capture the launch though. I for one bought the current launch device with the thought that they were happy with the device and that they would use the current setup for the virtual courses. The launch setup works with the original p3pro courses and range and will alter the height of the shot. I was led to believe that it would work with the virtual courses. It's just unfortunate because if I was told that their launch angle device was going to be discontinued for a new device then obviously one would have waited. Well anyway, I digress. I do think that the launch angle setup is not just for clubfitters and in fact better suited for home users. Clubfitters are better to have a true launch monitor with measurements of ball speed, direction, backspin, sidespin and spin axis. Home users may not need all this info but knowing at least the launch would be valuable.

I will contact the p3pro folks this week. I have lots of good ideas for the launch setup (Not that they need my ideas) but more importantly would love to be involved with the setup or testing of their new product.

[bubba22]

No new news on the p3pro launch and GSA courses. The p3pro technical expert had no idea about their potential upgrade or discontinuation. Does anybody else have any new info?

[dvshx]

readygolf it would be nice if you could elaborate on the information you have.

It is good news that they are looking at a design change to capture the launch though. I for one bought the current launch device with the thought that they were happy with the device and that they would use the current setup for the virtual courses. The launch setup works with the original p3pro courses and range and will alter the height of the shot. I was led to believe that it would work with the virtual courses. It's just unfortunate because if I was told that their launch angle device was going to be discontinued for a new device then obviously one would have waited. Well anyway, I digress. I do think that the launch angle setup is not just for clubfitters and in fact better suited for home users. Clubfitters are better to have a true launch monitor with measurements of ball speed, direction, backspin, sidespin and spin axis. Home users may not need all this info but knowing at least the launch would be valuable.

I will contact the p3pro folks this week. I have lots of good ideas for the launch setup (Not that they need my ideas) but more importantly would love to be involved with the setup or testing of their new product.

well explained bubba. spin is very important in club fitting. in short, p3pro launch add on should just be for home users. i hit some low iron shots that are almost skulled but in simulation for virtual courses, it stops softly on the green. It feels misleading sometimes.

[bubba22]

dvshx you are on the exact same thought process as me.
The launch would not be for everyone but I suspect the majority of users that realize the importance of it will absolutely purchase it. The launch add on will always give you the option of shutting of the launch measurement for cases where you want not as skilled players to be confident with hitting the sim. My suggestion is they market the p3pro as a club analyser/simulator with optional add ons. Launch (webcam or whatever they are looking at) for the home user and launch monitor measurement (Zelocity/Vector/Flightscope ---launch,spin,ball speed and direction) for the teaching pro/clubfitter or really avid home user. Time will tell.

[bubba22]

dvshx I like how you describe a skulled shot on the sim as feeling misleading. Really sums it up on the need for launch .

[readygolf]

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[bubba22]

Is your golf training center in Wilton? How are you getting all your info ? Well I think the explosion of the golf sim industry will change that fact as more competitive products such as the dd etc are made. I do think a lot of the 90 percent of sales is due to marketing the LA towards clubfitters. It should be marketed at the home user and leave the launch monitor for the clubfitter. When you look at the price of the webcam launch device compared to other means of acheiving launch, it is really peanuts. That is how it should be sold and truthfully so. Users will want more and more as time passes and launch will be one aspect. P3pro would be smart to jump on this opportunity to get an up on the competition .

[bubba22]

readygolf any new info?

[bubba22]

Are there any other p3pro users with the launch add on? Just as an aside, the ps3eye webcam is capable of capturing 120 fps but needs the appropriate software support. P3pro video capture and launch will only support 30 fps. the potential for the p3pro is so high and would only take some software tweaks for the launch and potential ball cam. Its too bad they don't see this as it would definitely increase there sales.