Best Goaltender in World?

[davevandyk]

I know this is a poll-type question, so...

Who do you think is the best goaltender in the World?

For me its Thomas Greiss from Germany. He had a Save Percentage over 80, which is an A... I was always damn happy with that.

[nokids]

Who is Thomas Greiss ? are we talking soccer, hockey, or water polo?

[LobWedge]

I know this is a poll-type question, so...

Who do you think is the best goaltender in the World?

For me its Thomas Greiss from Germany. He had a Save Percentage over 80, which is an A... I was always damn happy with that.

If that qualifies as an A grade, then Martin Brodeur's career .914 save percentage over 1000+ games makes him a Rhodes Scholar, I guess.

[Big Johnny69]

Dave, an interesting question indeed, but I truly believe you can only call an NHL goalie as the best in the world. If you're not playing with the best of the best, I don't think you can be considered one of the best in the world, unless you put up some astronomical stats.

[jonf]

I don't understand the question (or I just missed the sarcasm in your choice of Thomas Greiss, who is not even the best goalie on the Sharks)

[sillywilly]

in order...

Brodeur
Plante
Hasek
Roy
Tretiak or Sawchuk.. can't decide

[Big Johnny69]

in order...

Brodeur
Plante
Hasek
Roy
Tretiak or Sawchuk.. can't decide

Most people forget to include George Hainsworth on this list. Check out his career stats....very impressive.

[davevandyk]

Bad attempt at sarcasm I guess. I mean who do you think is the best goalie right now in the 2009-2010 season. Not the best resume, but just this season's performance, including olympics.

Maybe Miller, Brodeur, Luongo, Fleury, Lunquist?

[jonf]

This season? Miller, hands down.

If I was a GM choosing a goalie for the next five years? Cam Ward, hands down.

[sillywilly]

this year, it has to be between miller, nabakov or bryzgov

[Big Johnny69]

Bad attempt at sarcasm I guess. I mean who do you think is the best goalie right now in the 2009-2010 season. Not the best resume, but just this season's performance, including olympics.

Maybe Miller, Brodeur, Luongo, Fleury, Lunquist?

You need to use the emoticons to your advantage Dave....then we would've got your joke.

[sillywilly]

cam ward over the next 5 years??? you know his BEST save% ever is 0.916
also, loungo has only TWICE been below that, 2001 he was at 0.915 and in 2005 he was 0.914

his career average is .14 better and his goals against is .25 lower.

how can you possibly want to take ward over loungo????

This season? Miller, hands down.

If I was a GM choosing a goalie for the next five years? Cam Ward, hands down.

[jonf]

How? Because the Stanley Cup is engraved only with names, not statistics. Luongo has never made it past the 2nd round of the playoffs. Ward won a cup his first year, and took the Canes to the conference championships last year, after a goaltending duel for the ages with Brodeur. His statistics are not amazing, but he wins games when they matter most. There are only two stats that matter for goalies: Wins, and Playoff Wins.

[fundonny]

Sigh.... WINS is a team stat, not a goalie stat... Save % is the best stat for goalie comparisons.

[Big Johnny69]

I don't think there is any 1 best stat for a goalie. Take save % for instance. A goalie like Vokoun has a very high save percentage because he plays for a team that gives up lots of shots, and lots of those are easy save shots. So his save percentage is inflated simply by the number of shots he faces per game. Doesn't necessarily mean he's a great goalie. Then you get a goalie who plays in a very defensive oriented system that doesn't give up many shots, so save percentage is high solely based on the fact he doesn't face many shots a night.

You have to look at a goalie as a whole when it comes to his stats. Take Patrick Roy for instance. Played in a very defence first type system with Mtl, won lots of games, saved lots of shots, won Cups. Then off to Col, an offence first type of team. Still put up great stats and was still a champion. To me, if a goalie can put similar stats in different team systems, to me, that is the sign of a great goalie.

[mpare]

I think that you have this right, Geoff.

...

You have to look at a goalie as a whole when it comes to his stats. Take Patrick Roy for instance. Played in a very defence first type system with Mtl, won lots of games, saved lots of shots, won Cups. Then off to Col, an offence first type of team. Still put up great stats and was still a champion. To me, if a goalie can put similar stats in different team systems, to me, that is the sign of a great goalie.

[leftylucas]

What about the innovation to the position? Like Roy the butterfly, Brodeur the puck handling, these must have place in the selection process. Bobby Orr is considered so great because he changed the way the D-man played the position.

[jonf]

Sigh.... WINS is a team stat, not a goalie stat... Save % is the best stat for goalie comparisons.

But it isn't...at all. I mean...it's a nice stat for a very cursory comparison of two goalies, and how they are performing at a given time. But basically, as soon as you get up over 900, the difference is fairly insignificant. At that point you have to look at something important, like whether that goalie crumbles in the playoffs, or whether he rises to the occasion.

[sillywilly]

A goalie like Vokoun has a very high save percentage because he plays for a team that gives up lots of shots, and lots of those are easy save shots. So his save percentage is inflated simply by the number of shots he faces per game.

save% = saves/shots. it's no inflated by the number of shots allowed. some would argue that the more shots you face the lower your save % will be, opposite of what you are saying. it gives the goalie a chance to get into the zone. 2 goals on 20 shots and 4 goals on 40 shots are the same save %. the GAA average is double however

Then you get a goalie who plays in a very defensive oriented system that doesn't give up many shots, so save percentage is high solely based on the fact he doesn't face many shots a night.

YES, if you played for a team like BUF or NJ in the 90s where they bored you to death with the trap then the goalie stats were def inflated. They face far less shots and far less high quality scoring changes but its not the save % that is effected, its the GAA.

You have to look at a goalie as a whole when it comes to his stats. Take Patrick Roy for instance. Played in a very defence first type system with Mtl, won lots of games, saved lots of shots, won Cups. Then off to Col, an offence first type of team. Still put up great stats and was still a champion. To me, if a goalie can put similar stats in different team systems, to me, that is the sign of a great goalie.

his gaa and save % were better in COL but that has more to do with the equipment changes.

Bottom line, if a goalie faces a ton of shots or faces a few shots.. the one with the better save % is playing better. they are both facing shots from OVI, malkin, crosby over the course of the season... vokun leads the league in save % and shots faced. very impressive.

my vote is still for miller. he has a very high save % and very low GAA

[jonf]

most goalies will tell you that it's easier to play well when you're getting plenty of action. The fewer shots you face, the more difficult it is to get into the game.

Anyone know a good website for obscure hockey stats? I'm trying to find stats on goalies' records in elimination games in the playoffs. While it is telling, the "Luongo let in 7 goals in the final game against the Hawks last year" argument will clearly not satifsy your 'stats are the only thing that matter' approach, so I'm trying to get some numbers to back me up.

[sillywilly]

not what you are looking for but still interesting

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/hocke...rankings_N.htm

[goochy]

My only issue with all the stats obsession is it tells you nothing of the quality. If a goalie lets in 2 goals on 10 shots but they were very high quality shots, is his 80% save average really meaningful compared to someone who saved all 10 weak and low percentage shots for a 100% average.

I know the quality evens out somewhat over a long period but I agree with jonf that once it gets above 90% comparisons probably become pretty meaningless based purely on stats.

Someone mentioned Greiss at the start of the thread sarcasticly, but I thought his performance against Canada kept the score down. I know he let in a lot of goals but he was facing a lot of shots of very high quality. I think there has to be a qualitative factor based on any opinion.

I'm not a hockey expert by any means but some one like Roy does spring to mind. Consistantly high performance over a long period of time and innovative technically