Which Ball?

[BC MIST]

A competitor's ball comes to rest on an old cart path in a poor lie. He lifts the ball and drops it two club-lengths from the nearest point of relief. After playing it, he is told that he dropped the ball in a wrong place. He announces that he will play a second ball under Rule 3-3 and wishes to score with it. He drops a second ball properly according to the obstruction Rule and plays it. With which ball must he score and why?

[Foddz]

I'll have a go...

Firstly, it is questionable if he were entitled to relief at all by the description of 'poor lie in an old cart path'. Does this lie meet the definition of an immovable obstruction? Or was it just some patchy grass on uneven ground? It is possible he should not have taken relief at all, and the improvement of his lie with either ball could be considered a serious breach and grounds for disqualification.

If the old cart path meets the definition of an immovable obstruction, then he would be entitled to one club length of relief. However, since he took two, it was an incorrect drop. This error was correctable without penalty until he took the stroke. After that, he was in violation of Rule 20-7 and incurred a 2-stroke penalty, and that ball is the one that counts.


If only the 2 club length drop constituted a serious breach, his second ball is the one that counts, with a 2-stroke penalty added to his score for the hole.

Did I miss any contingencies?

[BC MIST]

I'll have a go...

Firstly, it is questionable if he were entitled to relief at all by the description of 'poor lie in an old cart path'. Does this lie meet the definition of an immovable obstruction? Or was it just some patchy grass on uneven ground? It is possible he should not have taken relief at all, and the improvement of his lie with either ball could be considered a serious breach and grounds for disqualification.

If the old cart path meets the definition of an immovable obstruction, then he would be entitled to one club length of relief. However, since he took two, it was an incorrect drop. This error was correctable without penalty until he took the stroke. After that, he was in violation of Rule 20-7 and incurred a 2-stroke penalty, and that ball is the one that counts.

If only the 2 club length drop constituted a serious breach, his second ball is the one that counts, with a 2-stroke penalty added to his score for the hole.
Did I miss any contingencies?

"Poor lie on an old cart path." While the poor lie is irrelevant, some thought may be given to the "old" cart path. Is it artificially surfaced? If "Yes," it's an immovable obstruction. Has it been declared by the local committee to be an "integral part of the course? As there is no information about this, then obviously "No." Assuming then that is is artificially surfaced and not integral, your ruling is correct., that is, the golfer played from a wrong place, for which the penalty is 2 strokes.

It must be understood that if you play from a wrong place, your ball is in play. Because he played a second ball, he MUST get a ruling from the committee before returning his score card or he would be disqualified. It must then be determined whether his wrong place play gave him an unfair advantage, that is, a serious breach. If so, then he was obligated to correct this mistake and play from the right place. If the first ball was ruled not to count, then the score from the second ball would, assuming it was played in accordance with the rules.

Questions for AAA: (1) If the player above, when taking relief and playing from the wrong place, dropped the ball in foot high fescue grass versus 3" rough, would you consider his breach serious? (2) If the "old" cart path, originally covered with stone dust, was completely grown over with grass, would you still consider it artificially surfaced?

[AAA]

Questions for AAA: (1) If the player above, when taking relief and playing from the wrong place, dropped the ball in foot high fescue grass versus 3" rough, would you consider his breach serious? (2) If the "old" cart path, originally covered with stone dust, was completely grown over with grass, would you still consider it artificially surfaced?

1) Probably not.
2) Possibly yes but I would I really have to see it and know the player better

Thanks for your confidence :-0

[BC MIST]

1) Probably not.
2) Possibly yes but I would I really have to see it and know the player better

Thanks for your confidence :-0

I ask the questions because: (1) From 3" rough a golfer could easily advance the ball. However, from the fescue that we have here, that includes a lot of clover and thistle, finding the ball is a miracle, let alone advancing it and so incorrectly dropping the ball in the 3" rough gives the player a distinct advantage. (serious breach) Is serious breach then, solely a distance advantage?
(2) At our course we have several French drains that are now completely covered with grass. But, simply tapping the grass with an iron and one knows that there are stones underneath, obviously creating a dangerous situation. To me, the overgrown cart path is similar and from both, relief would be warranted.

[AAA]

BC
1) I though that you were asking if dropping in the fescue when he should have dropped in the 3" rough would be a SB

[BC MIST]

BC
1) I though that you were asking if dropping in the fescue when he should have dropped in the 3" rough would be a SB

My carelessness. That's what I did ask but I meant dropping in the 3" (wrong place) versus the fescue ("right" place).

[AAA]

In that case, probably. But as in the other case one really needs to be there.
SB is a difficult call at the best of times. A few thousand miles away makes it even more.