Crosby - 400 points in 292 games

[mberube]

Sidney Crosby has reached the 400 points in only 292 games Saturday. Only 5 other players in LNH history has reached the 400 point marker in les games : Wayne Gretzky (197), Mario Lemieux (240), Peter Stastny (247), Eric Lindros (277) et Mike Bossy (283).

He is not as flashy as Ovy but effective.

[mberube]

Ovechkin is 15th with 314

Wayne at 197 is insane.

[nokids]

As a Red Wings fan, it's my duty to bash Crosby whenever I see people drooling over him. Ok I'm not going to bash him, but I am going to say what I think of him.

He is a very talented hockey prodigy, bred since he was a fetus to play hockey, drafted by a god-aweful club, and he's been the #1 guy for 5 years now. I'm not saying he doesn't have skill, he's got world class skills, he is in my top 10 of best hockey players today; however people need to stop judging players by their point totals without looking at the overall picture. Crosby gets his points because he and Malkin were the only good players for the Pens all these years. He had the majority of ice time on even strength, he plays more time on the PP than anybody besides Malkin, and he rarely does any penalty killing. He is basically just an offensive tool for the Penguins. As an offensive player, he is arguable 2nd or 3rd best player in the league between himself, Ovie and Malkin.

But now that the Pens are getting better as a team. Will Crosby follow in the footsteps of Gretzky and play casual defense while focusing on scoring, or will he go the way of Yzerman and set the example on the PK, sacrifice his numbers for the good of the team? There are two players I'd pick over Crosby at this point in time: Zetterburgh and Datsyuk. Both could put up Crosby type numbers if they didn't have to spend most of their time defending their net on the PK.

Let's look at last year as an example: Crosby averaged 5.5 minutes on the PP last year during the regular season. Pavel Datsyuk had 3.5 minutes on the PP per game. That's an amazing difference in minutes!!!! What are the results: Crosby had 7 goals, 33 assists = 40 pts on the PP. Datsyuk had 11 goals, 25 assists = 36 pts on the PP. They basically have almost the same amount of points even though Datsyuk had 160 minutes less time on the PP.

I wonder how much scoring Crosby would be doing if he actually had to exert effort into taking care of his defensive zone. His +/- would certainly be better than a +3. How do you score 103 pts in a season and end up with a +3??? That's some lazy Ovechkin-like defense right there. He even had a great goalie like Fleury to bail him out yet still barely comes out even. Datsyuk has a +34 and his last line of defense is Chris Osbad.

I hope I wasn't too hard on Mr. Crosby. I do think he deserves praise for all he's accomplished but there are other players doing the dirty jobs that win championships who dont get praised, and I'd like people to remember about them as well.

[mberube]

I don’t really care about all that. Those are debates that never end. All great players had an entourage. It’s the same type of debate between Gretz and Lemieux. I could reply by saying that Zetterburgh and Datsyuk have always been playing with one if not the best team in the league for most of there career while Crosby and Ovy racked up incredible number with a poor team with awful defensive play.

All I was stating is that he is making a mark in NHL history and his name is up their every year.

As for Ovy, if he keeps at it, we might see something exceptional this season.

[fundonny]

Bah, Crosby.... No interest.

[mberube]

If you have no interest, why post? Why even read the post?

[fundonny]

Ever since they tabbed him 'the next one', many were turned off. Ovy is the best player in the NHL.

[mberube]

Ever since they tabbed him 'the next one', many were turned off. Ovy is the best player in the NHL.

That's your opinion and that's OK but you still did not answer the question. If you have no interest in Crosby then why read a post that clearly states his name in the title? I don't understand.

I have no interest in NFL thus I don't read any post that has a title about NFL. That to me is the meaning of no interest.

[fundonny]

Cause I have an interest in hockey.

[fundonny]

Also not just my opinion, a large majority of NHL players too.

[moochie]

They are both excellent hockey players - they just play different games. Ovechkin is more fun to watch, IMO just as Mario was more fun to watch than Gretzky. Again, my opinion so no need to wait in the parking lot for me.

[fundonny]

Hahaha, good line.

[mberube]

Also not just my opinion, a large majority of NHL players too.

Now that's funny. Are you in the NHLPA committee? When was your last survey amongst the NHL player in regards of who they think is a better player?

I do believe you are an NHL fan but it still does not explain why you read a Crosby post when you obviously don't like him.

I would like to note that this was not a thread to debate who is better. This was a post about him scoring his 400th in a short period of time.

[mberube]

They are both excellent hockey players - they just play different games. Ovechkin is more fun to watch, IMO just as Mario was more fun to watch than Gretzky. Again, my opinion so no need to wait in the parking lot for me.

I completely agree. It's fun to read positive post.

[fundonny]

Now that's funny. Are you in the NHLPA committee? When was your last survey amongst the NHL player in regards of who they think is a better player?

I do believe you are an NHL fan but it still does not explain why you read a Crosby post when you obviously don't like him.

I would like to note that this was not a thread to debate who is better. This was a post about him scoring his 400th in a short period of time.

I posted it last winter, Sports Illustrated does a player's poll in every issue. That particular week they asked all NHL players who is the best player in the NHL. Can't remember the exact statistic, but I seem to remember Ovy and Lidstrom being 1-2. I believe around 10% may have chosen Syd.

[fundonny]

Found it...

SI did a PLAYERS poll and asked who the best player was in the NHL. It was Ovechkin, BY FAR! Like way over 50% of the vote. I think Sid was tied for 2nd, I'll have to double check, with around 10% of the vote. Personally I don't think he's even the best player on his team either.


And, if you notice you mentioned many other players in your post, which leads to comparisons, which leads to debate. You specifically mentioned Ovy. If you didn't want comments/opinions/debates, you should have locked the thread after your fist post.

[mberube]

That’s true for the 2009 season. I remember TSN making a survey at the end of the season when Crosby finished first with 120 points. Most players were giving there votes to Sid but that is beside the point. Everyone is entitled to there opinion and that’s fine by me. Note again that this tread is not a thread to find out who is better.

[nokids]

It's not about who is better, i agree. But why does the media shove Sidney Crosby down our throats? There are 800 other NHL players. I'm tired of his TV commercials, his billboards, his face on video games, his name on hockey sticks at Canadian Tire, it's overload. If he was a mile better than everyone else on the ice i could understand. But he's not even the best NHL player TODAY!! That is why people like me, and Donny can't stand him. He's a whinny brat; complaining to the refs about everything, even telling the refs to call a delay of penalty on Washington because fans were throwing hats on the ice after an Ovechkin hat trick. Come on now.

[fundonny]

If he hadn't been forced fed to me, like pea soup when I was a child, I'd probably like him. I hate pea soup.

[nokids]

If he hadn't been forced fed to me, like pea soup when I was a child, I'd probably like him. I hate pea soup.

and i hate wine. or should i say, WHINE.

[jeffc]

Crosby has a cup. Ovechkin doesn't. That's all that really matters. As for Datsyuk, he was invisible in the playoffs last year.

[nokids]

Crosby has a cup. Ovechkin doesn't. That's all that really matters. As for Datsyuk, he was invisible in the playoffs last year.

he was busy playing defense. hence why Crosby will never get a Selke trophy.

[nokids]

Let's not start comparing Crosby to Datsyuk because there is no comparisson. none. Datsyuk is an offensive genius and maybe the top defensive forward in the league as well. He has the stats to back it up to go along with his two cups. He's a complete player in his prime. Sid has yet to learn what two-way hockey means. +/- doesn't lie.

[jeffc]

he was busy playing defense. hence why Crosby will never get a Selke trophy.

hmmm, perhaps he should be been putting a few more pucks in the net and they would have won.

[mpare]

I doubt very much that Crosby loses any sleep worrying about what any of us think about him as a hockey player. Why should he? He's a great hockey player, who is making loads of money, playing a game he obviously loves. For my part, I'm thankful that I get to watch him, Ovechkin, Datsyuk play. Each has the ability to capture my attention and thrill me. I can't ask for more.

[nokids]

hmmm, perhaps he should be been putting a few more pucks in the net and they would have won.

he didn't play the first 4 games of the finals because he had a broken foot he suffered from blocking a shot in the Chicago series. It's a miracle Datsyuk played in the finals at all. What's Crosby's excuse for his clutch performance?

Crosby: 7gp, 1g, 2a, 3pts -3
Datsyuk: 3gp, 0g, 2a, 2pts +1

[jeffc]

Let's not start comparing Crosby to Datsyuk because there is no comparisson. none. Datsyuk is an offensive genius and maybe the top defensive forward in the league as well. He has the stats to back it up to go along with his two cups. He's a complete player in his prime. Sid has yet to learn what two-way hockey means. +/- doesn't lie.

actually +/- is probably the most overrated stat in hockey. Anyone remember Andrej Mezaros?

Don't get me wrong, Datsyuk is an excellent player, probably the best 2 way player in the league but to say Crosby is not in his league is simply just wrong. Datsyuk plays on a team that has a strong commitment to defense, and one of the best defenses in the league, led by arguably the best defenseman to every play the game. He benefits significantly from that. Are you saying Ovechkin isn't in his league either? By your argument he isn't. Most would consider him the best in the league - as would I.

I do find it a little bizarre that someone who is 4th in the league in scoring during the regular season and logs 97 points is 50th in the post season with a grand total of 9 points.

[jeffc]

he didn't play the first 4 games of the finals because he had a broken foot he suffered from blocking a shot in the Chicago series. It's a miracle Datsyuk played in the finals at all. What's Crosby's excuse for his clutch performance?

Crosby: 7gp, 1g, 2a, 3pts -3
Datsyuk: 3gp, 0g, 2a, 2pts +1

I'm sorry I thought you said he was busy playing defense.

yes, let's look at the playoffs:

crosby: 24 games, 31 points, +9, 1.29 ppg, second in scoring and he won the cup.
Datsyuk: 16 games, 9 points +5, .56 ppg, 50th in scoring and the wings blew a 3-2 lead in games.

[jonf]

This entire exercise is perposterous. I was watching the NHL on tsn today, and they were, once again having the crosby ovechkin debate. The guys basically admitted that the entire debate was assinine and useless - that their opinions would change with ever week, every event, every season. They basically admitted that their entire career is a succession of useless observations that are obselete and irrelevant the moment they are uttered. It both amused and frustrated me to hear these guys talk so obliviously about the pointlessness of their observations, and their general redundancy.

So, why don't we just end the neverending pissing contest of stats and observations that will inevitably result in everybody walking away convinced of the righteousness of their own opinions. Then, we can reconvene in 3 weeks to repete the same debate over again.

And Mike Richards is the best player under-25

[fundonny]

Jon I love it when you contribute to a thread. And I love that we can go through the whole thing again in 3 weeks!

BTW, for Crosby to jump to the next level, let's see him at least get a 40 goal season. = )