Citizen Lineup 2009

[Kilroy]

Clublink members should at least get a break on this IMHO.

Slightly off topic... Does CL have an Ottawa Championship between courses?

[jvincent]

The problem with giving Clublink members a break is that I'm sure the fee that Clublink charges for the course is fixed.

[Indio]

Clublink members should at least get a break on this IMHO.

Slightly off topic... Does CL have an Ottawa Championship between courses?

Why Dan? It is not being put on by Club Link and the organizers have to pay for the green fees for 144 players (albeit at a discounted rate). I know at any semi-private or private course if you as a member join an 'outside' tournament that is being held at your club, you pay full pop to enter anyway. (That has been the case of the 2 courses I have belonged to in the past).

[Kilroy]

I understand that, but isn't it double dipping when their own players are in the field? An admin fee for the tournament would be OK. Anyway, I know that's not how it works but it doesn't seem fair to the members this way. It doesn't affect me. It's just my opinion.

[LobWedge]

Slightly off topic... Does CL have an Ottawa Championship between courses?

Colby could answer for sure, but I don't believe so. They have an inter-club championship, by it's for all CL courses.

[GarthM]

Colby could answer for sure, but I don't believe so. They have an inter-club championship, by it's for all CL courses.

No there is no Ottawa-only tournament, just the Clublink Interclub in Muskoka every year which includes all clubs. Tough to make the team for sure, but great swag!

[Indio]

I understand that, but isn't it double dipping when their own players are in the field? An admin fee for the tournament would be OK. Anyway, I know that's not how it works but it doesn't seem fair to the members this way. It doesn't affect me. It's just my opinion.

It would be double dipping if it was Club Link organizing the tournament, that I agree but since it is the Citizen (title sponsor), they have negotiated a price with each club based on field numbers (not knowing how many club link or club members would join the tournament).

I would be interested to hear what the Club Link answere would be if a member approached them for a rebate of their green fee portion of the cost to see how Club Link would view it. I bet they would say 'hey, it was your choice to join a tournament that was being held at your own course for an extra fee and no, we will not be providing a rebate to you'...

[quinner]

Why does everyone always want something for nothing?

Sounds like suggesting that people want a "free ride" to me.

[mberube]

As you said those who want to play will play, those who don't will always find a reason not to.

I resent that statement. I’ll speak for myself. I love to compete. I competed all my life in hockey, golf, martial arts, soft ball…. I would love to play in the Citizen BUT I have a young active family and a job that does not necessarily give me the opportunity to play in weekly tournaments. Budget wise, it costs a lot of $$$$ to play golf all season. $150 plus 2 to 4 days off is hard to swallow but at $200 it’s near impossible for my budget anyway. If the two first courses were two courses that I never have that chance to play it would be easier to spend the money. If I hade the game to be a top 10 contender it would be easier but it’s not the case. You guy may not understand but some of us have other thins in life then Golf and we have a budget to maintain. It isn’t cuz we are finding ways to not compete….

Mike

[GarthM]

My statement was not directed at you or anyone in particular, if I offended, I apologize.

The bottom line is, everyone's situation is unique and we all have to make the decision based on our own individual circumstances. It has nothing to do with one's level of competitivness, far from it -- and I was speaking only of Marc and myself in that scenario. For myself the enjoyment of competition factors in higher in the decision making than it may for others.

Knowing you (Mike), I know your situation is signficantly different than mine, I know that you have other commitments/priorities in your life at this time that are higher on the list than a couple days off for the Citizen to satisfy your desire to compete.

As you said, if the opportunity to play new courses was there, then your decision tree would be adjusted. So would mine.

Garth

I resent that statement. I’ll speak for myself. I love to compete. I competed all my life in hockey, golf, martial arts, soft ball…. I would love to play in the Citizen BUT I have a young active family and a job that does not necessarily give me the opportunity to play in weekly tournaments. Budget wise, it costs a lot of $$$$ to play golf all season. $150 plus 2 to 4 days off is hard to swallow but at $200 it’s near impossible for my budget anyway. If the two first courses were two courses that I never have that chance to play it would be easier to spend the money. If I hade the game to be a top 10 contender it would be easier but it’s not the case. You guy may not understand but some of us have other thins in life then Golf and we have a budget to maintain. It isn’t cuz we are finding ways to not compete….

Mike

[mberube]

It’s not as much as priorities as being able to take the time off and dish out $200. It’s more a question of money then wanting. I would love to play this tourney but I’m not paid for sick days and 2-4 days off my pay check plus $200 is significant.

[Hacker]

It’s not as much as priorities as being able to take the time off and dish out $200. It’s more a question of money then wanting. I would love to play this tourney but I’m not paid for sick days and 2-4 days off my pay check plus $200 is significant.

But being the upstanding citizen that you are you would use Holiday days and NOT sick days to play golf.............right?

[jvincent]

Mental health day.

Based on my last two attempts, I'd be happy to have to take three days off.

[mberube]

But being the upstanding citizen that you are you would use Holiday days and NOT sick days to play golf.............right?

Like I said earlier, I’m a family man. Holidays are for family time. All I can say is that I am very lucky to have a girl friend that doesn’t say a word concerning me being a CL member. I surely don’t want to push my luck.

[Indio]

Like I said earlier, I’m a family man. Holidays are for family time. All I can say is that I am very lucky to have a girl friend that doesn’t say a word concerning me being a CL member. I surely don’t want to push my luck.

You are also a SMART man Mike

[LBH]

So $200 to play Kanata Lakes and Stonebridge??? Thanks but no thanks. I was going to enter this year but I won't pay $200 for a course I personally hate, that I can play for free and that I cannot score on (Kanata). Too bad...

[Hacker]

Clublink members should at least get a break on this IMHO.

I don't understand why CL members should get a break? CL is being paid for the use of their course on that day and for that day the course is effectively closed for business - it is not available to CL members. If they want to play in the tournament then they pay the same as anyone else.

I've experienced this many times when I was member at numerous courses back east. If there is a tourney then the course is closed to the membership but if you want to enter the tourney you pay the entry fee.

[Kilroy]

I get that. It is how it is. I have never seen it as fair.

[BC MIST]

I get that. It is how it is. I have never seen it as fair.

The host golf club receives 'x' dollars per player entry for permitting the tourney to be played there. With Club Link courses often used to host and with the disproportionate number of CL players entered, non CL would then have to pay significantly more to make up the difference. Is this fair?

[Kilroy]

Obviously some members who want to play in this don't like it much either judjing by the comments here.

This has been standard practice at clubs for years, if not forever. Why shouldn't they if people are willing to accept it. That doesn't make it right. It's still double dipping when you charge your members for green fees. As I said, a token tournament admin fee would be more appropriate for these players.

I'm sure I'd see things differently if I owned a golf course and wanted to maximize revenues.

Anyway, my opinion is worth nothing and I don't see a point in debating it beyond that.

[Sakuraba]

At Renfrew, there is a big tournament every year called the links of friendship. Its open to memebers and non members. In the past 7 or 8 that I have played in, they have always given the members a break on the price, roughly = to the green fee. Why do they do this? (I believe it comes from being the best-run course in the world), I guess it is the same reason they tell you when you phone to book a tee time if the greens have been recently aerated...

[mberube]

At Renfrew, there is a big tournament every year called the links of friendship. Its open to memebers and non members. In the past 7 or 8 that I have played in, they have always given the members a break on the price, roughly = to the green fee. Why do they do this? (I believe it comes from being the best-run course in the world), I guess it is the same reason they tell you when you phone to book a tee time if the greens have been recently aerated...

Too bad it too far for me...

[marcf]

At Renfrew, there is a big tournament every year called the links of friendship. Its open to memebers and non members. In the past 7 or 8 that I have played in, they have always given the members a break on the price, roughly = to the green fee. Why do they do this? (I believe it comes from being the best-run course in the world), I guess it is the same reason they tell you when you phone to book a tee time if the greens have been recently aerated...

Who runs this tournament, is it the club hosting and running it, or is it an "outside event" that the club has nothing to do with?

That's the lynch pin in the whole discussion...

[Kilroy]

Ultimately it's the club that recieves the green fee portion either way. The organizer's just collect the money and pay it in one lump sum.

[Sakuraba]

Who runs this tournament, is it the club hosting and running it, or is it an "outside event" that the club has nothing to do with?

That's the lynch pin in the whole discussion...

I can't answer that, I don't know.
fwiw I think the citizen is a bargain, an extra special bargain if you are not a member of one of the participating courses of course, & if you place high enough they charge you $0 for the following year also.

[Bouche]

I think im out this year to. No guarentees on how much practice I can get in this year...and 200$ is just too much. Kanata and Stonebridge does not equal 200$ in my mind.

[Thunder]

bla bla bla....it is funny to read all this. I remember the first year I played I thought $150 was expensive for the courses but for 4 rounds and a tourney and a shirt...not bad. Now at $200 it's the same thing...but the courses are much better, the prizes are great...everyone keeps talking about 2 rounds only. Well only we are in control of how many rounds we play...hopefully 4 for everyone. But the only way to improve our games is to compete against the best...we can't pick and choose where the tourneys are...that's done for us! We can choose what tourneys we play in though. For me, I won't play in the Quebec Amateur...it's in Montreal, 3-4 days, meals, hotels, time off work etc...your looking at atleast $600-$700 for that tourney. So although everyone makes valid points, we are all entitled to our own decisions, so lets stop bashing each other and the courses. Personally, I feel for $200 it's a great deal knowing that you could get potentially 4 rounds at great courses, a golf shirt and a nice meal.

Just my 2 cents!

Good luck to whoever enters!!

[Big Johnny69]

bla bla bla....it is funny to read all this. I remember the first year I played I thought $150 was expensive for the courses but for 4 rounds and a tourney and a shirt...not bad. Now at $200 it's the same thing...but the courses are much better, the prizes are great...everyone keeps talking about 2 rounds only. Well only we are in control of how many rounds we play...hopefully 4 for everyone. But the only way to improve our games is to compete against the best...we can't pick and choose where the tourneys are...that's done for us! We can choose what tourneys we play in though. For me, I won't play in the Quebec Amateur...it's in Montreal, 3-4 days, meals, hotels, time off work etc...your looking at atleast $600-$700 for that tourney. So although everyone makes valid points, we are all entitled to our own decisions, so lets stop bashing each other and the courses. Personally, I feel for $200 it's a great deal knowing that you could get potentially 4 rounds at great courses, a golf shirt and a nice meal.

Just my 2 cents!

Good luck to whoever enters!!

All good points. But realistically, not everyone that enters is going to be around for the 4 rounds. The appeal to the players that didn't really have a chance at proceeding past the first cut was getting to play two courses they normally wouldn't have a chance to play. And at $150, it was a usually a good deal. Some just wanted to get some free swag and a chance to play some nice courses. But now upping that cost by $50 and having the first two rounds at courses that people can play for less than $100 each is not going to appeal to those that wouldn't have a chance of going past the first cut, free swag or not.

I think that is where some of the negative replies and frustration are coming from. For players like yourself, Kyle Koski and others, the $200 is still a great deal, for 4 rounds of golf at very nice tracks. But for players like myself for instance, I'd rather play SB and Kanata for much less than $200.

[hoolio]

Who runs this tournament, is it the club hosting and running it, or is it an "outside event" that the club has nothing to do with?

That's the lynch pin in the whole discussion...

I can't answer that, I don't know.

The tournament in question is organized by a committee of current and past members. The tournament has been going on for over 35 years, and the point of it is to allow past and current members to come meet up annually and have a good time. There's a trophy handed out, but given that our buddy hoisted it a few years back with at least a 12-pack in his system, comparing the tournaments is like apples & oranges.

I'm a little late to the discussion, catching up on three weeks worth of topics is rather tedious.

[Thunder]

Ok fair enough... But Kanata as a guest is $100 or there abouts and Stonebridge is $65. Plus a golf shirt brings you over $200. then you still have the opportunity to play in 1 or 2 more rounds at the Marshes and Rivermead...not bad. In the past, clublink guys have been dealt the short straw with all the CL courses. 3 out of 4 a couple years ago. 2 CL courses last year...but it's a tourney and a chance to compete and have fun with the boys. Also, depending on your tee time, you can always work half days...not like out of town tourneys where you have to take full days off and be away from family. Once again, to each there own. I agree with everybodies statements, just hate hearing people complain...this is the way tourneys work and always will!