club fitting VS feel fitting

[luigicactus]

I would like to get some opinion / advice on a dilemma. I've been building my clubs for a couple of years. I know I risk to be crucified by some, I've only been measuring and trimming following chart and then spining my shaft, but I never measured swingweights pr checked my lies and lofts. So, all of my clubs probably have swingweights that are all over the place.
Once my clubs have cured, I fit them on the driving range going with feel and a big roll of lead tape. It takes me a couple of days ( a few hours at a time) as I want to be fresh for every clubs. I end up with clubs that feels just right for me and perfect trajectory.

Now my actual dilemma : I just bought some KBS shafts to go in my Bridgstone J33 CB. And wondering if I should do my good old feel fitting sessions, or if I should go see a real clubfitter / clubmaker to have them personnaly blueprinted... I know I would benefit having my lie and loft checked...

Anyone else do what I call feel fitting?
Anybody knows a good fitter that would not mind me bringing my heads, shafts and grips (as I also have brand new Winn grips)?

[Chieflongtee]

Chances are that the swingweight will not be that far off if the shaft weights and head weights were within tolerance to begin with

Your feel feeling method is not a bad one per say. In a way you are fitting yourself el generic way but what you are doing is somehow MOI matching and flex matching your clubs just a like a fitter would do. It just takes longer. A lot of players on tour tweak with lead tape until it feels right to them. If you were to measure the swingweight of your irons I bet that they would not be swingweighted matched.
Now your only problem is to find out if the lofts and lies are what they're supposed to be. There are very expensive measuring devices out there but if you don't want to go that route just get a magnetic protactor and measure them to the best of your ability.
Flex is another story and a never ending debate.
As of late someone claims that the 4 cpm slope is too steep and the actual tip trimming between clubs should be 1/4 instead of the usual 1/2 inch.Some others claim that the same frequency across the set is best If you want to be close to bang on flexwise just make sure all the shafts you will use weight the same.

I say find your nirvana tabarnakand never mind the rest

[jvincent]

The most obvious question I have is have you ever measured the clubs after you have done your "feel" fitting? If you were to do that and magically found that your clubs all came out at a specific SW then that would be a good indication of how to build your next set.

In my particular case, 44" driver with a 75g shaft at D2 is my magic combo. Chances are if I build a driver to those specs it will work well for me. This doesn't mean I won't try other combos of course.

As you say, adjusting for loft and lie are good to do, but of course require more gear than most hobbiests have at their disposal.

[luigicactus]

Thanks guys. Those are pretty good inputs. Now I only wish I would have check the swingweights before I pulled all the shafts and remove the lead tape in preparation for the new shafts! But I'll make sure to do that ounce my new Nirvana is found. I'll take your advice and record the right numbers and start my next built from that (which hopefully will be in a few years... nahh)
Quite anxious to try out those KBS shafts... It's a pain to see all those components laying on the work bench waiting to be assembled...

[The Saint]

If it was me in your shoes I wouldn't build the whole set, I would just assemble one and tweak it to your feel method. Measure the sw and then assemble another with the same sw. It may be close to the feel you strive for. If it is then great you can assemble for your preferred sw. If that experiment doesn't pan out well stock up on the lead tape

[BC MIST]

If it was me in your shoes I wouldn't build the whole set, I would just assemble one and tweak it to your feel method. Measure the sw and then assemble another with the same sw. It may be close to the feel you strive for. If it is then great you can assemble for your preferred sw. If that experiment doesn't pan out well stock up on the lead tape

The original poster builds the balance of his set based on one club giving him the perfect trajectory and feeling just right. Matching the balance of the set to the swing weight of the "master" club, will give him a set that has a matched WAGGLE FEEL. However, he is obviously interested in a set that has the same SWING FEEL, and a set with the same SWING FEEL is MOI matched, and of course, all have different swing weights but ones that follow a pattern. Obviously a SW matched set is NOT MOI matched, and vica versa.

Since MOI and SW are mathematical calculations, all one has to do is measure the length, weight, balance points of the components of the "master" club and then adjust the length, weight and balance points of the other clubs to achieve an MOI match, or even a SW match if that's all he wants. A gram scale and a ruler is all that is required for this. It is my opinion that an MOI set is better when combined with single frequency trimming but there will likely never be a consensus on that.

[Chieflongtee]

balance points of the other clubs to achieve an MOI

Are you saying that A moi matched set has the same balance point across the set?

[BC MIST]

Are you saying that A moi matched set has the same balance point across the set?

I should have used the word OR instead of AND. It is my understanding that this is what Swing Sync did.

[Chieflongtee]

I don't believed SS are MOI matched.Still investigating. Simply matching the balance point does not yield a MOI match. Especially if weight is added underneath the grip. Adding weight underneath the grip does not affect frequency readings one bit. Adding weight to the head does affect frequency. What it does is it changes the club total weight and balance point. A couple weeks ago I fooled around with some lead tape. Lead tape added to the middle of the shaft or higher does not change the frequency readings. I then added 28 grams or so along the length of the shaft and the frequency only changed by 3 cpms softer. Now if I had added 28 grams to the head it would have been a different story. As well I have 2 hybrids (3-4) . MOI readings on the speedmatch is 2620.8 and 2660.2 respectively. Swingweight C6.3 and C8.6 in the same order Length 39.5 and 39.25 in the same order. Balance point exactly the same on both clubs.
This is where the new counterweighting method comes in as the extra weight can be moved to different locations underneath the grip therefore changing the MOI(not as much as head weight) but mostly overall weight and feel.

[Tex]

I have had the pleasure of fitting and talking the game of golf with so many in my shop and the only thing I tried to instill from driver reshafts to full fittings was the game is about feel and what works for you. I felt too many people have become hooked up on pure and the "microfitting" of golf... Yes I believe in spining shafts but over something at fundimental as the swingweight and feel of your club. Before we have even taken it back it must feel good in your hand... So like to believe in my own unwritten list of specs for your clubs and when they are important..I like swingweight so that It feels good in your hand.. Shaft length,and yes it CAN, be fit for anyone, and should be ... Flex and frequency are durring your swing so if your good enough to go a tight eight out of ten shots then those shafts should all tuned. lie is also something that can be fit at that point. The reason I say eighty percent is that how can you build a club to be consistant if your not. My thought is that its a feel game we need to keep it simple if we want to have fun.... -The game is hitting a ball with a stick into a hole-. I hope I may have helped someone out there enjoy the game a bit more.