Cart Path Rule

[BillD]

Hi All. I know it sounds stupid but I really have a brain cramp when it comes to the cart path drop rule. Can someone explain in laymans terms, that I cannot forget. Where do I drop when I am on a cartpath????

[jvincent]

The rule is always "nearest point of relief".

Note that this does not mean "nicest point of relief". The example which comes up most often is when the ball is on the right side of the path for a right handed golfer. In this case the nearest point of relief is almost always on the right side of the path. Sometimes that means it will be in a forest. You don't get relief from forest.

One situation where you would get relief on the other side of the path is if out of bounds were very close to the right side of the path since you cannot take relief out of bounds.

[BillD]

So are you saying that I drop on the side of the path that the ball is closest to?

[jvincent]

Generally speaking, yes.

The USGA website has some good animations/diagrams on this. I think the RCGA may have some as well.

[BillD]

Thank you sir.

[BC MIST]

So are you saying that I drop on the side of the path that the ball is closest to?

While John's answer of "generally speaking, yes," is correct, please do not assume that because the ball is right of the centre of the cart path, that it must be dripped on the right side, IF you are right handed.

A reasonable procedure is:
1. leave the ball on the cart path
2. take the club you would use if the cart path was not there.
3. go to the left and address an imaginary ball that just gives you relief from the path. Mark where the ball would be with a tee
4. do the same on the right side, making sure your heels do not touch the cart path. Mark the "ball" with a tee.
5. step back and see which point is nearest to the ball on the path.
6. measure one club length from the NPR (driver gives you maximum area in which to drop)
7. drop the ball from shoulder height, arm extended, between the two tees.

The length of the club that you chose is also a factor that helps determine where the nearest point of relief is. If it is a 3 wood, then a ball can be closer to the right side of the path, and yet the nearest point of relief will still be on the left side.

[BillD]

This is an excellent explanation. Thanks a lot BC

[AAA]

The following might help. Although it shows GUR the process is exactly the same for paths or other immovable obstructions

25-1b/2 Diagrams Illustrating “Nearest Point of Relief”
The following diagrams illustrate the term “nearest point of relief” in Rule 25-1b(i) in the case of both a right-handed and left-handed player.
The “nearest point of relief” must be strictly inter-preted. A player is not permitted to choose on which side of the ground under repair he will drop the ball, unless there are two equidistant nearest points of relief. Even if one side of the ground under repair is fairway and the other is bushes, if the nearest point of relief is in the bushes then the player, if taking relief, must drop the ball within one club-length of that point, even though he may have to drop the ball in a virtually unplayable lie.

B1 = position of ball in ground under repair, etc.
P1 = nearest point of relief
P1-A-A = shaded area within which ball to be dropped, radius of one club-length from P1, measured with any club
B2 = position of ball in ground under repair, etc.
= notional stance required to play ball at P2 with club with which player would expect to play the stroke
P2 = nearest point of relief
P2-C-C = shaded area within which ball to be dropped, radius of one club-length from P2, measured with any club

B1 and B2 are the positions of the ball in ground under repair, etc.
P1 is the nearest point of relief for B1
P2 is the nearest point of relief for B2
Shaded area P1-A-A = dropping area for ball at B1
Shaded area P2-C-C = dropping area for ball at B2
= player’s notional stance to play ball at P1
The same procedure applies under Rule 24-2b dealing with immovable obstructions.

[Kiwi battler]

jvincent ! , what exactly does "very close" mean ? 36 inches? 24? 12? 6?

[Foddz]

Close enough to keep you from obtaining full relief from the cart path.

[BC MIST]

jvincent ! , what exactly does "very close" mean ? 36 inches? 24? 12? 6?

As the right handed golfer must take complete relief, the measurement would be from the golfer's heels to where the club he would use if the path was not there, touches the ground. The measurement for a 5' golfer with a wedge would be different than a 6' 6" golfer with a 3 wood, and the kind of setup he has, ie. whether arms close to the body (traditional setup) or arms extended (single axis setup), however, the range would likely be 2.5' to 4'.

Obviously then, if the golfer cannot find a point on the right side that gives him complete relief without dropping OB, the NPR would be on the left side. This is one case where size does matter.

[Hacker]

As the right handed golfer must take complete relief, the measurement would be from the golfer's heels to where the club he would use if the path was not there, touches the ground. The measurement for a 5' golfer with a wedge would be different than a 6' 6" golfer with a 3 wood, and the kind of setup he has, ie. whether arms close to the body (traditional setup) or arms extended (single axis setup), however, the range would likely be 2.5' to 4'.

Obviously then, if the golfer cannot find a point on the right side that gives him complete relief without dropping OB, the NPR would be on the left side. This is one case where size does matter.

Nice

That one caught me totally off-gaurd

[jvincent]

jvincent ! , what exactly does "very close" mean ? 36 inches? 24? 12? 6?

What BC said.

[Kiwi battler]

Oh ! , my bad ....I was assuming OOB was close to the left side of the path
Can I ask again ?

[Sakuraba]

Lets say you've correctly established npr, and it puts you in some bushes. Can you elect to drop on the cart path? It looks from the GUR diagram that you cannot drop in the GUR, so I'm pretty sure you can't drop back onto the cart path?

[Kilroy]

If you dropped on the path, would you be taking full relief from the path?

[Sakuraba]

If you dropped on the path, would you be taking full relief from the path?

well, in the hypothetical situation, if the npr was terrible, I am wondering if playing it as it lies is the only option (besides taking an unplayable) I can imagine a situation where a shoulder-height drop on the path could produce an improvement, especially if the cart path was paved.

but to answer your question, I guess I wouldn't be taking full relief then, would I?

[Kilroy]

Nope. To take relief, you must take full relief.

[Kiwi battler]

And you shouldnt relieve yourself on the path

[nokids]

While John's answer of "generally speaking, yes," is correct, please do not assume that because the ball is right of the centre of the cart path, that it must be dripped on the right side, IF you are right handed.

A reasonable procedure is:
1. leave the ball on the cart path
2. take the club you would use if the cart path was not there.
3. go to the left and address an imaginary ball that just gives you relief from the path. Mark where the ball would be with a tee
4. do the same on the right side, making sure your heels do not touch the cart path. Mark the "ball" with a tee.
5. step back and see which point is nearest to the ball on the path.
6. measure one club length from the NPR (driver gives you maximum area in which to drop)
7. drop the ball from shoulder height, arm extended, between the two tees.

The length of the club that you chose is also a factor that helps determine where the nearest point of relief is. If it is a 3 wood, then a ball can be closer to the right side of the path, and yet the nearest point of relief will still be on the left side.

holy smokes. i wouldn't be able to remember all that.

if you're in a tournament, is there someone there to explain the rules to you? imagine getting disqualified because you didn't know what to do.

[BC MIST]

holy smokes. i wouldn't be able to remember all that.

if you're in a tournament, is there someone there to explain the rules to you? imagine getting disqualified because you didn't know what to do.

The procedure may sound complicated but once you have gone through it a couple of times, you will see how simple it really is. Depending on the tournament, there are usually at least 2 officials on the course so when you find your ball on a cart path, there may not be one in sight. Asking your playing partners what to do may help but when you are in doubt you may wish to play a second ball, dropping it in another spot that you feel may also be correct. When you do this you MUST indicate with which ball you want to score, if the rules allow. Then, when you see an official explain what you did and they will give you a ruling.

Better still, before you tee off in a tournament and if you are still not sure, get someone to show you what to do.

[Kiwi battler]

Id call the procedure simple ......BUT , its still easy to make a mistake , just like adding 2 numbers

I saw a rules official totally overlook the fact the NPR was in a garden from which further relief would be granted onto a teeing ground , the poor young guy asked if he drop on the teeing ground , rules official said NO , drop other side of the path .....on a nasty slope and dead behind a bush

It can often be messy when you have multiple obstructions/conditions .....learn the rule inside out and you can save strokes when most people would drop them

[AAA]

Sorry, the diagrams didn't seem to work

Try this link

http://www.usga.org/bookdecision.aspx?id=14303#25-1b/2

[nokids]

Sorry, the diagrams didn't seem to work

Try this link

http://www.usga.org/bookdecision.aspx?id=14303#25-1b/2

so let's use this diagram for a hypothetical situation. suppose the "ground under repair" rectangle is the cart path. i'll pretend i'm left handed and my ball lands on B2. i am allowed to drop the ball one club length from the edge of the cart path onto area C because its in the direction of play. I wont be able to drop my ball one club length into area A. is that right?
if we keep all the variables the same and my ball landed on B1, i'd have to drop the ball one club length into area A.
and in both cases i dont lose a stroke?

[LobWedge]

so let's use this diagram for a hypothetical situation. suppose the "ground under repair" rectangle is the cart path. i'll pretend i'm left handed and my ball lands on B2. i am allowed to drop the ball one club length from the edge of the cart path onto area C because its in the direction of play. I wont be able to drop my ball one club length into area A. is that right?
if we keep all the variables the same and my ball landed on B1, i'd have to drop the ball one club length into area A.
and in both cases i dont lose a stroke?

Not exactly. From B2 you drop into area C because its the nearest point of relief for both ball and player, with the ball being the determining factor in measuring, not because it's the direction of play. If your ball lands at B1, then yes, area A is your NPR because it's the nearest complete relief for your stance and the ball. In either instance, if you choose to take relief from the obstruction, as long as you take complete relief from it, there is no penalty.

[nokids]

Not exactly. From B2 you drop into area C because its the nearest point of relief for both ball and player, with the ball being the determining factor in measuring, not because it's the direction of play. If your ball lands at B1, then yes, area A is your NPR because it's the nearest complete relief for your stance and the ball. In either instance, if you choose to take relief from the obstruction, as long as you take complete relief from it, there is no penalty.

you know what's confusing? when would the NPR not be the area which the ball is closest to? would that be a situation where the closest area is an out of bounds area, water, or something unplayable like that?

thanks

[LobWedge]

you know what's confusing? when would the NPR not be the area which the ball is closest to? would that be a situation where the closest area is an out of bounds area, water, or something unplayable like that?

thanks

Sure, for a right-handed player, say your ball was laying on a cart path very close to the right-hand edge, and there is an area through the green, right next to that right edge of the path, but it's only a couple of feet wide, and then to the right of that is the margin of a water hazard. There may be "relief" for the ball to the right of the path, but there is not enough room for the ball and your stance. The rule says that your NPR cannot be in a water hazard, so your nearest point of complete relief would now be to the left of the path. There are areas on the right side of the 10th & 15th holes at Loch March where this can happen.

[PapaPat]

holy smokes. i wouldn't be able to remember all that.

if you're in a tournament, is there someone there to explain the rules to you? imagine getting disqualified because you didn't know what to do.

Ah, but 6-1 says that each player is responsible for knowing the Rules. Do you think that hitting good shots is all there is to this game? I wonder when some people decide that they are entitled to distract others to cover for their lack of willingness to assimilate the required understanding of the game.

Or, more curious, a player in a GAO District Championship, after having a rule explained to him remarked, "Why should it be to my disadvantage to be paired with you, just because you know the rules?" When it comes to the RofG, wilful ignorance is rampant.

[mpare]

That's the funniest thing I've heard in a long time.

Or, more curious, a player in a GAO District Championship, after having a rule explained to him remarked, "Why should it be to my disadvantage to be paired with you, just because you know the rules?" When it comes to the RofG, wilful ignorance is rampant. [/FONT][/COLOR]

[nokids]

Sure, for a right-handed player, say your ball was laying on a cart path very close to the right-hand edge, and there is an area through the green, right next to that right edge of the path, but it's only a couple of feet wide, and then to the right of that is the margin of a water hazard. There may be "relief" for the ball to the right of the path, but there is not enough room for the ball and your stance. The rule says that your NPR cannot be in a water hazard, so your nearest point of complete relief would now be to the left of the path. There are areas on the right side of the 10th & 15th holes at Loch March where this can happen.

it's starting to make sense. does this relief rule apply to a ball sitting on grass but which is very close to a man-made artificial thing in your way? i had the misfortune on 11th hole at LM to have my ball sit next to the bricks along the cart path. i couldnt make a normal chip shot, so i hacked at it with a sandwedge. could i have moved it without a penalty?