Doubt as to Procedure

[BC MIST]

Intermediate/Advanced difficulty.

Many know that if a golfer is unsure of a ruling in STROKE play, that he may - (1) play two balls, (2) declare with which ball he wants to score, if the rules allow, and (3) that he wants a ruling. In MATCH play, though, playing two balls is not permitted. In fact, if you do play two balls, as outlined above, the rules deem the second ball to be a wrong ball, and you lose the hole.

However, while it may seem contradictory, there are circumstances where playing a second ball, in match play, is allowed. Any ideas?

[jvincent]

The only one I can think of is a provisional ball.

You are allowed to play your provisional until you reach (or is it pass ?) the point at which the original ball may be lost. If you play the provisional after you pass the point then the provisional is in play.

[rezadue]

This is an interesting point John. Last year, during the forum fun day at EC, something like this happened to Spackler and I. On #3, I pulled my drive left which we thought might have kicked back out of the woods. We looked for it and could not find it (60 seconds). So I went back to the tee and hit a declared provisional to the right side of the fairway.

As I was driving up to the provisional, I found the first ball in the corner of the fairway and played it. Spackler and I both thought it was the right decision. However when we discussed it later with Fally, we thought the first ball was dead and we may have decided incorrectly, in my favour.

Am I understanding the rules properly that what we did ended up being correct.

Sorry for the slight misdirection of your thread BC, but I thought this was a similar situation and would be relevant.

The only one I can think of is a provisional ball.

You are allowed to play your provisional until you reach (or is it pass ?) the point at which the original ball may be lost. If you play the provisional after you pass the point then the provisional is in play.

[Kilroy]

I pulled my drive left which we thought might have kicked back out of the woods. We looked for it and could not find it (60 seconds). So I went back to the tee and hit a declared provisional to the right side of the fairway.

Once you go forward to look for your ball, you can no longer play a provisional. Therefore when you returned to the tee, the ball you hit was in play. When you abandoned it for the found ball, you lost the hole.

[rezadue]

I understand. But let me ask this. What about a case when you hit a ball right into the middle of the fairway and therefore have no reason to hit a provisional, only to go to where the ball is supposed to be and not be able to find it?

Last year at Chateau Cartier on the second hole I hit a drive down the middle of the fairway which all of my FCs saw. But it had disappeared by the time we got there.

Once you go forward to look for your ball, you can no longer play a provisional. Therefore when you returned to the tee, the ball you hit was in play. When you abandoned it for the found ball, you lost the hole.

[Kilroy]

Lost ball.

[BC MIST]

The only one I can think of is a provisional ball.

You are allowed to play your provisional until you reach (or is it pass ?) the point at which the original ball may be lost. If you play the provisional after you pass the point then the provisional is in play.

This is true, but your provisional is not IN PLAY until the original, by definition, is lost.

[BC MIST]

Answer: For those who play in Intersectional type matches, the playing of two balls in match play becomes a distinct possibility.

I can think of two occasions where a player will play two balls in match play. Assume that you are playing Intersectionals, 3 independent, concurrent matches, or a Three Ball, 2 matches. One of your opponents tees off ahead of the markers, OR, plays out of turn. Each opponent has the option of recalling that stroke. If A made the mistake, B recalls the stroke and C and D do not, then A must put another ball in play for B while playing out the original ball for C and D. Decision 30-2/1 (a)

While slightly related, if B concedes A's par putt, but C and D do not, A must still putt out, even though the outcome for B has already been decided. If A misses, it does not change the result with B. A would effectively have two scores for the hole, a 4 and a 5.

Hmm. I wonder what score he would use for handicapping purposes?

[sillywilly]

lyle after a putt is given may a player still putt it for his handicap? Or must he pick it up? Or does that not matter? Just trying to get some extra info on how things work with handicapping a mtch.

[Kilroy]

The handicapping manual deals with this.

4-1. Unfinished Holes and Conceded Strokes
A player who starts, but does not complete a hole or is conceded a stroke must record for handicap purposes the most likely score. The most likely score may not exceed the player’s Equitable Stroke Control limit, defined in Section 4-3. This most likely score should be preceded by an “X.” (See Decision 4-1/1.)

There is no limit to the number of unfinished holes a player may have in a round, provided that failure to finish is not for the purpose of handicap manipulation.

Example 1: A and B are partners in a four-ball stroke-play competition. On a hole on which neither player receives a handicap stroke, A lies two, 18 feet from the hole. B lies two, 25 feet from the hole. B holes a putt for a 3. A picks up on the hole, because A cannot better B’s score. A records X-4 on the scorecard because 4 is A’s most likely score.

Example 2: A and B are playing a match. On a hole on which neither player receives a handicap stroke, A has holed out in 4; B has a 30-foot putt for a 5. B has lost the hole, and picks up. B records X-6 on the scorecard because 6 is B’s most likely score.

Example 3: A and B are playing a match. On a hole on which neither player receives a handicap stroke, A is one foot from the hole, lying 4. B is 10 feet from the hole, lying 3. B putts and misses. They both concede a half. Both players record X-5 because that is their most likely score.

[Kilroy]

You may putt out for your cap if you wish.

[BC MIST]

lyle after a putt is given may a player still putt it for his handicap? Or must he pick it up? Or does that not matter? Just trying to get some extra info on how things work with handicapping a mtch.

If you are playing the kind of matches I have described above, the answer is, "No," for the following reasons:
It is bad etiquette.
If you putt your concession before anyone else in the group has holed out, your stroke may be of assistance to someone else.
If you putt after the group has holed out, you are subject to disqualification as it is OVGA policy that practice putting is not permitted.
If you are playing with your friends and you practice putt afterwards, you may he holding up the group/field that is following your group.

Say, "Thank you," pick up the ball, and go get the flag.

[sillywilly]

If your fc is inthe hole and you have lost that hole how do you determine your most likely score? How close do you have t be to assume you would have 1 putt it? How far do you have to be to say a 3 putt was more likely hrere than a two putt? I would have slot of trouble deciding if I should write x-5 or x-6

[Kilroy]

For the few times it happens it won't make much difference.