Short Backswing

[Ty Webb]

I have dramatically reduced my score this year by shortening my backswing (ala Allan Doyle). I was trying to emulate the pros and, by mistake, realized that a shorter backswing allows me to hit the ball straighter and more consistantly (albeit it doesn't look pretty but neither do I). I am able to hit my 5 wood in the 180-200 range using this approach.

I am constantly bugged about this by my playing partners and have the following questions for the gurus residing within:

1. What am I losing by taking a compact backswing?
2. Why does this facilitate me hitting straighter/more consistant?
3. Any thoughts/comments if I should change this and/or how do I perfect this?

Cheers

Ty

[jeffc]

especially with the pros and on their irons (less so on their woods). I've been doing the same thing with my irons. Less distance for the club to travel = less room for something to go off line.

I find I hit my irons just as far, and more consistent. I can't seem to do the same with my woods, it just doesn't feel right.

[Rough Stuff]

I think you've analysed it perfectly. You might lose a few yards, but you gain incredible accuracy. Don't listen to people who raze. Many times, I've taken an abbreviated driver and it flew 250+...you hit the sweet spot far more often, which produces far more distance than a fast swing off centre of the s-spot.

That said, a full/perfect swing AND hitting the sweet spot is the ultimate goal. But look at it this way: if you use an abbreviated swing and ingrain it perfectly, you have very little work left to do to increase it to the full swing. You also have swing to fall back on if the full swing gets "wonky".

In answer to your question, it faciliates a straighter and more consistent shot because there is less chance of things going wrong. I think you should make sure your compact swing is something that you can expand to a full swing, other than that there's nothing wrong with it.

[Andru]

I think you've analysed it perfectly. You might lose a few yards, but you gain incredible accuracy. Don't listen to people who raze. Many times, I've taken an abbreviated driver and it flew 250+...you hit the sweet spot far more often, which produces far more distance than a fast swing off centre of the s-spot.

That said, a full/perfect swing AND hitting the sweet spot is the ultimate goal. But look at it this way: if you use an abbreviated swing and ingrain it perfectly, you have very little work left to do to increase it to the full swing. You also have swing to fall back on if the full swing gets "wonky".

What the heck is a perfect swing??? I thought the ulitmate goal was to get the ball in the hole in the fewest number of strokes.

Ty

Don't get caught up in "THE PERFECT SWING" because it doesn't exists. There's only one perfect in golf, and that's the shot that goes exactly where you wanted it to. Via a long back swing like Tiger. Short one like Doyle or somewhere in between like John Cook. It sounds like you're heading in the right direction. Don't change a thing. Let it happen naturally if it's going to happen. Your club head speed through the ball will improve as you become more comfortable.

Doyle AVG 266.2 and Thorpe AVG 279.6 from the tee. That's pretty good. You can develop that kind of speed it just takes practice.

And make sure you have fun doing it.

Cheers ( PS: read my signature )

[Rough Stuff]

What the heck is a perfect swing???

My apologies Andru, I thought it was clear. By perfect swing I meant hitting the sweet spot. You would agree that hitting with the sweet spot consistently WILL ALWAYS make the ball go farther? Well partial swings are more consistent in that regard. For that matter, swinging the club like a putter will increase consistent sweet spot contact. Clearly hitting the sweet spot with faster and faster club head speed will make it go even farther, but you have to walk before you can run.

Whether you go with Andru's religion or someone elses, they all require practice, practice, practice and patience, patience, patience. Just like get rich quick schemes, quick fixes don't work.

[beatnik58]

I've done the same thing recently and seen a dramatic improvement in accuracy and scoring. It's hard to resist the impulse to overswing but once you get the feel of a 3/4 backswing it frees you up to hit through the ball and turn at impact. I look at is this way, if i don't waste energy trying to swing like Daly there is more of that energy directed through the ball at impact. I'm hitting longer and straighter than ever before.

Don't listen to the knuckle draggers who think length of backswing = manliness. Just hit your shot clean, go find it in the middle of the fairway and hit it again. Then smile as your big hitting companion curses as he scours the rough and the woods for his wayward 300 yard boomer!

[GarthM]

I agree completely.

3/4 backswings are a great way to ingrain good swing habits and gain confidence. Besides which, you would be surprised how "full" a 3/4 swing actually is! Most people tend to overswing anyways, so having them think they are only going back 3/4 of the way, actually creates a full swing.

Good luck!

GarthM

[Colby]

I have dramatically reduced my score this year by shortening my backswing (ala Allan Doyle). I was trying to emulate the pros and, by mistake, realized that a shorter backswing allows me to hit the ball straighter and more consistantly (albeit it doesn't look pretty but neither do I). I am able to hit my 5 wood in the 180-200 range using this approach.

I am constantly bugged about this by my playing partners and have the following questions for the gurus residing within:

1. What am I losing by taking a compact backswing?
2. Why does this facilitate me hitting straighter/more consistant?
3. Any thoughts/comments if I should change this and/or how do I perfect this?

Cheers

Ty

Ty,

I've played with people from all over, including some older golfers who have lost some flexibility and cannot perform a full swing.

As I am looking for my over-swung ball in the rough, trees, high bushes, etc, they are hitting their second shot from the middle of the fairway.

A reasonable par 4 from the whites is say 350-360, with some up to 400, some less than 350. So these old guys hit 180-200 off the tee, but its up the middle. Their second shot is in the same range, 180-200. If they are just off the green, it's a chip and a putt, if they are on the green it's a two putt for par, maybe a one-putt for birdie. So they are averaging par on every par 4, par 5's are the same, par 3's are simple, unless they are long. The only issue is a course that has a long carry over a gully or water off of the tee.

It sounds like boring golf, and may be, but when I saw the 80 year old shoot his age while I stunk up the course, something was wrong with what I was doing. Sure enough when I took a lesson, one of the things I was told was that I was over-extending on my backswing, my left elbow was breaking. In order to keep that elbow straight, I had to reduce my back-swing and that has helped considerably. I think I have a chance to compete against that 80 year old now (especially if I sabatoge his walker!!) (and for those of you who might have taken that last comment seriously, it was a "joke")

[Ty Webb]

Colby, where did you take your lesson?

[Colby]

Colby, where did you take your lesson?

I took it out at the Marshes with Dave Powell. He's the president of the Ottawa PGA. I met him at the OAC golf school last winter. A very good teacher. I was having a problem with coming over the top, casting and a number of other issues. With his help I broke 80 and have dropped my handicap index from around 18 at the start of the spring to 12.5 after lasts nights 84 from the blues at Predator on aerated greens (stupid 3 putts)

Lessons at the Marshes aren't the cheapes, I bought a three hour package for 225 (75 an hour) and we've split it into a one hour foloowed by four 30 minute sessions. I have an hour left which I need to get in before the snow flys, hmmm time to call

[NoBack]

Shorter backswing will help for sure. Look at a guy they calll Tiger ....

When he first appeared on the PGA, he used to be able to read the sole of his clubs because they were below eye level on his backswing. He wasnt as accurate with it but it sure was longer. Then he got shorter and and more accurate. If it can work for him, maybe it could work for you too.

Colby ......................

I think I have a chance to compete against that 80 year old now (especially if I sabatoge his walker!!)

Better hope he doesnt' hit you with it.

I have an hour left which I need .....

ok......do i dare touch this one?

[Andru]

Whether you go with Andru's religion or someone elses, they all require practice, practice, practice and patience, patience, patience. Just like get rich quick schemes, quick fixes don't work.

No need to apologise. I thought your post was great up until the perfect remark. Thanks for clarifying your point. I took it out of context.

I hate talking swing mechanics but I find myself drawn in. The top 1/4 of the the golf "SWING" is non-active anyway. Most instructors will tell you to let the hands fall from the top.

[Andru]

Be careful with the 80 year old. remember what Bob Barker did!!!

[natgolfer]

I am constantly bugged about this by my playing partners and have the following questions for the gurus residing within.Why would you be concerned about what your playing partners think of your swing. Let your golf clubs talk for you.

1. What am I losing by taking a compact backswing?
Nothing. So don't worry about it.

2. Why does this facilitate me hitting straighter/more consistant?
I have posted this before, but the myth of a FULL swing is a "vertical" left arm with the club shaft horizontal. This is nonsense, even though this is frequently taught. Consider this: The backswing is full and complete when your left shoulder is at or just past the ball. If your left arm is horizontal, vertical, or "3/4", (a detestable term,) your swing is still full. A couple of good local players Lee Curry(just made the Canadian Tour for 2004) and Mike Walker have their left arm at the "3/4" mark, with the shaft horizontal, because of flexible wrists. But, the left shoulder is slightly behind the ball. I have seen others with a left arm slightly past horizontal and a full shoulder turn, hit the ball a ton. The key is to marry the shoulder/body swing with the arm swing for your particular amount of flexibility. If either is too short or too long relative to the other, poorer shots will result. Most golfers swing too far back with their arms for the amount their body turns, resulting in the arms or wrists breaking down, or even the grip loosening.

3. Any thoughts/comments if I should change this and/or how do I perfect this? Don't change a thing.

The two most significant ways to score well is to have a sound short game and putting stroke and to avoid hitting bad shots in the rough or worse that will cost you shots. If scoring is important to you then, 250 yards in the fairway is better than 275 yards in the rough, 9 times out of 10. How many strokes are taken off your score for hitting the ball 300+yards? Hit the ball as far as you can, without sacrificing accuracy, and if shortening your arm swing will achieve this, do it.

A long straight driver has an advantage, but simple geometry shows that
the farther the ball goes, the greater is the chance of hitting it crooked.

[beatnik58]

I have been practicing with a 3/4 swing with great results. I played Calabogie today and hit 13 of 14 fairways with drives in the 225-250 range. Golf is much more enjoyable when you're not scrambling from the rough/woods/other fairways!

[The Shtick]

Natgolfer-

What is your point??

[Rough Stuff]

Natgolfer-

What is your point??

Schtick...he's answering the original questions posted by Ty.

[The Shtick]

OOPS!!!

My bad.... d'oh! :freak5

[beatnik58]

Natgolfer-

What is your point??

Hmmmm I get asked that a lot!

[el tigre]

Most golfers swing too far back with their arms

I totally agree with this statement, and in fact I would also add that most golfers swing farther back with their arms than they THINK they do.

This is where a quick video session with a golf pro can help. Personally, I was convinced I had cured myself of this problem until I had a video done at a winter golf school. I THOUGHT I was doing a 3/4 swing - in REALITY I was still overswinging but with a slower tempo. According to the golf pro, EVERYONE is surprised by how far back they are swinging the club when they see it on the video tape.

Now, I THINK I'm doing a 9:00 backswing (i.e., left arm horizontal). My playing partners tell me it is more like 10:00 or 10:30. It seems to be working for me.

[natgolfer]

I totally agree with this statement, and in fact I would also add that most golfers swing farther back with their arms than they THINK they do.

As mentioned above the use of a video camera to first see how far back the arms are really going, and then to relate the feeling of a "shorter" backswing to what you see on tape is very beneficial. Each golfer has to develop their own FEEL of where they should be to achieve the desired results, as FEEL does not always equal REAL.

When my left shoulder touches my chin, my shorter, but ideal backswing length is complete. When I feel my shoulder push firmly into the chin, I have gone too far back.