Moving Flagstick

[natgolfer]

A discussion occurred over the following possible scenario. A player is putting from say, the 9 o’clock position on a green that is fast and severely sloped from back to front and the flagstick has been removed and placed significantly below the hole(6 o’clock). The putt lips the cup and rolls downhill towards the flagstick. (Probably #10 at Stonebridge )

At that point, may any player in the group pick up the flagstick to avoid the ball hitting it?

One side says that once the ball is in motion, the flagstick may not be moved, while the other side says that the flagstick may be picked up and is treated as though it is an attended flagstick.

Rule 17-3a simply says that the ball shall not strike the flagstick when removed, and makes no reference to its being moved, once the ball is in motion.

Perhaps this is a recent ruling change.

Any thoughts?

[gbower]

After looking in the Decisions on line this is what I found regarding this situation.


17-1/6 Attended Flagstick Placed on Ground Subsequently Lifted
Q. After a stroke is made, the person attending the flagstick removes it and places it on the ground. He then realizes the ball might strike the flagstick, so he picks it up. What is the ruling?

A. There is no penalty. The flagstick is deemed to be attended by the person attending it until the ball comes to rest and it may be moved by the attendant to a position where the ball will not strike it. (New)


The question that I have what happens if someone other than the person that was attending it moves it??

[Gary Hill]

Rule 24-1:
When a ball is in motion, an obstruction which might influence the movement of the ball, other than an attended flagstick or equipment of the players, shall not be removed.

natgolfer did not explicitly say so, but "removed and placed on the ground" away from the hole implies that the flagstick was not being attended when the stroke was played.

Therefore, NOBODY can touch the flagstick once the ball is in motion.

Again, I would caution everyone to refrain from using the Decisions Book.
A clear understanding of the Rules is needed before attempting to apply specific decisions to a ruling.

[LBH]

Makes perfect sense... But what would be the penalty if somebody does move the flag?

Also, the best way I've found to avoid this situation is to always place the flagstick off the green (fringe or rough) uphill from the hole unless the hole is located in the back tier of the green at which case I place the flagstick off the green as far away as possible from the hole...

[o4par]

I guess azinger's caddy wasn't reading this post! :crying

[Gary Hill]

This thread has nothing to do with Azinger's penalty.

[o4par]

This thread has nothing to do with Azinger's penalty.

My apologies mr hill..I should have been more specific in that i was referring to your reply and comment re "nobody can touch unattended flagstick while ball is in motion". Now, had the caddy read that he'd be more the wiser.

Apparently (i may be wrong again)..Kendra (i believe that is her name), on the golf channel mentionned that the same ruling that affected Azinger's situation has been revised and will be introduced in january '04?

rt

[Gary Hill]

No need to apologize. I wanted everyone to be clear that this thread was specifically about a ball which might actually strike the flagstick.
So the incident falls under Rule 24.

Whether or not Funk's ball would have struck the flagstick was never an issue in the Azinger ruling.
So that incident falls under Rule 17-2.

Yes, Kendra Graham confirmed that the Rule has already been changed.
The full text of the Rule may be found here.