Do I Record A Game for Handicap

[1972Apex]

The handicapping system that we use is excellent, but imperfect, and the match play scenario is one area that has a little grey in it, however, the logic in doing it this way, makes perfect sense and will have no negative affect on one's factor.

Perhaps like you, I abhor the use of handicaps, not because the system is flawed, it's not, but because there is such a high percentage of golfers who cheat, whether knowingly or not, making competitions where handicaps are used, a joke, and it takes only one sandbagger to ruin the competition for everyone.

I prefer that golfers tee it up, make the best score possible on that day and to the low scorer(s) goes the spoils, period. But, the reality that there is such a wide variance in scores makes it necessary to group golfers according to some predetermined criteria, and factors are what is almost always used. How else could it be done to ensure a fair competition?

In long distance running, we use age groups to determine winners as older guys don't have the physiological ability to run as fast as the young ones. In some curling competitions they use years of experience. Any other ideas?

Like you BC, I have grown to hate the handicap system for the same reasons. I much prefer to play straight up against other golfers regardless of handicaps.
In many other sports in which I have played, squash, motorcycle racing etc., competition is broken up into divisions. In squash it was A, B, C, D divisions. You moved up as you beat better players or in the case of racing, performed well in competition. There were still sandbaggers and reverse sandbaggers, but nothing like golf.
I wish there were more straight up A, B, C and D competitions available locally in golf. It would give players of equal skills levels a chance to really test their games against level competition.
I really don't see the point of a 'B' level golfer giving up 10 strokes to a D for a competition. Really they should not even be playing each other. It would be like a 'B' motocross racer giving up a 1 lap head start to a D. Why not just separate them into different divisions?

[nhwott5]

how woudl you deicde who is an a, b, c or d player? you need a ranking, this is the handicap. like Geoff says, in most tourneys here, there are no caps, just flights drawn fomr the cap of the player.

[logan69]

I have been reading this thread for about the last half hour and have been very amused. I have to agree with BC on this one all the way. I too have been involved with the handicap committee at my club for the past 5 years or so. It's amazing how many golfers do not know the rules of golf or understand the handicap system. When it comes to rules, it is a very touchy subject and cannot be pushed on anybody. I do take the time however to explain any rule to a member who asks. If I don't know the answer, I will find it out. We do however stress that it is VERY important to post ALL scores (providing they are not scrambles). All we can do BC is teach the rules and hope they follow accordingly.

[BC MIST]

I would argue that cheating is intentionally breaking a rule that you are aware of.

Recording a wrong score because of not knowing a rule or misinterpreting a rule, while a mistake, is not cheating IMHO.

I have been taken to task for referring to the unintentional breaking of rules, golf or handicap, as cheating. what word or expression would you use to differentiate between the two?

Because the net result is the same, and because there can be a negative affect on the outcome of certain competitions, making a score or using a handicap that is not accurate is still cheating/breaking the rules, or whatever you want to call it. According to Harry Frankfurt, in his book "ON BULL," if you deliberately tell an untruth it is a LIE, but if you tell an untruth, not knowing that it's an untruth, it's bull#$*%. So I guess we need a word for unintentional cheating. Golfpoop?

Will I get banned for using the above term in that context?

[BC MIST]

I have to agree with BC on this one all the way. I too have been involved with the handicap committee at my club for the past 5 years or so. It's amazing how many golfers do not know the rules of golf or understand the handicap system. When it comes to rules, it is a very touchy subject and cannot be pushed on anybody. I do take the time however to explain any rule to a member who asks. If I don't know the answer, I will find it out. We do however stress that it is VERY important to post ALL scores (providing they are not scrambles). All we can do BC is teach the rules and hope they follow accordingly.

I agree that the first task of a handicap committee and of a rules committee is to educate the members in the basics of each. At our club, for this year, we have provided a number of means to inform golfers of their handicap obligations and we have seen significant improvement in the number of scores posted. However, there are still problems that need to be addressed.

It is one thing to educate, but the procedures MUST be enforced and the committee must find a way of dealing with those who refuse to comply. The manual outlines what can be done and hopefully when those who have refused to comply have their factor withdrawn or modified, they will shape up or NOT compete in any handicap competitions. Perhaps our second year will see more modifications done, as well as continued education.

Rules education is a much greater challenge because the rules are so much more complicated. We have weekly rules questions/quiz's at our men's nights, and based on reactions and the number of questions that we have received, there is a genuine interest in learning and playing by them. I disagree that the rules stuff "cannot be pushed on anybody." For competitions to be fair and to encourage participation, golfers need to know that they must play by them and be held accountable if they don't. We are making significant progress in this regard and will continue to teach and discuss the rules.

To those who are members of golf clubs or groups like the Slammer Tour, etc., what, if anything is done to further your golfers knowledge of both the handicap and golf rules?

[BullDog]

To those who are members of golf clubs or groups like the Slammer Tour, etc., what, if anything is done to further your golfers knowledge of both the handicap and golf rules?

I have a pretty good handle on the rules of the game. When I'm in a group with a newbie Slammer, I'll tell him/her at the beginning of the round that one of our objectives is to teach/learn more about the rules of the game.

From the ST site: "We all think we know the rules but The Slammer Tour lets you put that knowledge to the test by playing match play golf. Some rules are different in match play than in stroke play. You will be surprised at the new rules you learn when your match is on the line! We all learn from each other."

If I see a violation, I will usually wait until I'm walking along with the new guy and point out what he did, why it was wrong and strongly suggest that doing that sort of thing again the future might result in incurring a penalty. Usually after a few rounds, if that Slammer "takes" and returns again and again, he/she gains some experience and some knowledge about the more intricate parts of the game.

We have a claim procedure to follow if someone believes there was a breach of the rules. I think it's been used once or twice so far this season.

All in all, I've found that the Slammer Tour has been useful in a number of ways - and as each dozen or so games come and go, you pick up a few new things along the way!

Mike

[sharkshooter]

Given that the question of match play has been rather thoroughly dealt with, perhaps a question about "practice rounds".

Every summer, I play 2-4 times (usually only 9 holes) with my kids (aged 10 and 12). While I don't actually play 2 balls, does giving detailed advice to my "competitors" about distances, clubs to use, aim and set up, allow my to not record my score as I think I am breaking several rules?

I really do not play well (even for me) when I play for all three of us.

[jvincent]

Speaking from a position of no authority, I'd say that those should be treated as practice rounds.

[nhwott5]

i would agree with jvincent. and to be clear on it you could even just "declare" it practice befoe starting out. but just make sure you decide prior to platying and then follow whatever decision you choose. IE if you shoot real well, it remains a practice round!!