What should happen if.....

[Big Johnny69]

you play a set of irons that are way too soft of a flex for you? And I'm not talking going from a 6.0 to a 5.5, I mean what will happen if you go from a 6.0 to a 4 or 4.5?

[sillywilly]

hook maybe? I know stiff is a slice

[Chieflongtee]

They will feel better. Higher ball flight and ball going more left than usual.

[Big Johnny69]

They will feel better. Higher ball flight and ball going more left than usual.

Distance loss?

[Chieflongtee]

Distance loss?

No. Maybe a slight gain because of higher launch angle.


I will try to post some from wishon tonight to that effect.

[Big Johnny69]

No. Maybe a slight gain because of higher launch angle.


I will try to post some from wishon tonight to that effect.

Thanks Andre.

So if I was to say.....put a set of heads that were 3* up, into a set of shafts that were 4.0 or 4.5......they will feel smoother, higher ball flight (with possible no loss, perhaps a gain of distance)......and the ball should be straight to going more left......am I correct in assuming this?? If so, sign me up.

[Chieflongtee]

Don't know about 3 up. Sure if you hit the ball first but if you happen to hit the ground first look out left ob..

[Big Johnny69]

Don't know about 3 up. Sure if you hit the ball first but if you happen to hit the ground first look out left ob..

I'm not worried about OB left, but if I can get the ball flight straightened out some, that would be great.

[sillywilly]

Wouldn't it be better to get shafts that are stiff but with a lower kick than going to a much weaker flex shaft?

[jvincent]

This came up on the Wishon forums. Here was Tom's reply.

Typically if the golfer swings with a relatively late to very late release of the wrist cock angle, a more flexible shaft will arrive at impact flexed forward more than with their own stiffer shaft. The more the shaft is able to flex forward, the more this action also causes the face to close at impact. This is because the shaft is attached at the heel of the head so virtually all of the weight of the head is out there in front of the center line of the shaft. This results in the face closing a little more when the more flexible shaft bends forward a little more at impact than a stiffer shaft, and from that, hence comes a little more tendency to see more draw than with a stiffer shaft.

This won;t happen with all golfers who move into a much more flexible shaft. It only happens when the golfer is able to swing the more flexible shaft and not have its feel cause them to make other "changes" in their swing. For example, when most experienced golfers detect that a shaft is much more flexible, they know they have to "slow down" to get the shaft to feel as if it is coming to impact properly. Most golfers who make conscious adjustments to their swing to accommodate a change in a golf club never get everything timed just right and this can mean a difference in how the adjusted swing delivers the clubhead/clubface to impact.

TOM

[Chieflongtee]

hook maybe? I know stiff is a slice

Not really more slice or more hook. Too stiff a shaft will start the ball Right and low right away. If you have a slice or fade to begin with the ball will never have a chance to head for the fairway. A shaft does not cure a slice or a hook. The golfer does that but too stiff or too soft depending on the golfer will make matters worse.

[Chieflongtee]

http://golf.about.com/cs/tipslessons/a/shaftflex.htm

If Your Flex Is Too Stiff
What effect does a too-stiff shaft have on your golf game?

1. The ball will probably fly lower and shorter for any given loft, compared to a properly fit shaft.
2. The ball may tend to go to the right, or fade side, for right-handed golfers because with a too-stiff shaft the clubface is harder to square (the clubface is more likely to be open at impact, in other words).
3. The shot may feel less solid, more like a mis-hit even if you make contact on the center of the clubface.
If Your Flex Isn't Stiff Enough
And what will happen if your flex isn't stiff enough?
1. The ball might fly higher for any given loft, compared to a properly fit shaft.
2. The ball may tend to go left, or to the draw side, for a right-handed golfer (because with a too-flexible shaft, the clubhead may tend to come into the ball closed).
3. Shots may tend to feel more solid, even when they aren't.
Macho, Macho Men
Men like to hit Stiff shafts. It's a guy thing. Unfortunately, it's not always the smart thing.
No macho man wants to be seen hitting a wimpy little Regular flex club, or, Tiger Woods forbid, a Senior or Ladies flex.
But overswinging is a common problem among male high-handicappers. Choosing a softer flex often has the effect of forcing macho men to slow down their swings. And slowing down the swing often makes those macho men into better players. And the fact is, the harm in hitting a shaft that is too flexible is much less than the harm in hitting a shaft that is too stiff. As equipment guru Tom Wishon has said, when unsure about flex, always err on the side of more flex. If you can't decide between Regular and Stiff, go with Regular

[KickerOfElves]

Nicklaus always said to play as soft a shaft as you can control...

[Chieflongtee]

Thanks Andre.

So if I was to say.....put a set of heads that were 3* up, into a set of shafts that were 4.0 or 4.5......they will feel smoother, higher ball flight (with possible no loss, perhaps a gain of distance)......and the ball should be straight to going more left......am I correct in assuming this?? If so, sign me up.

Best if you try one first with the right lie angle. . If you like it then go for the whole set.

[sillywilly]

speaking from personal experience

I went to weaker flex shaft for my 3w and 5w and I'm getting lots more distance off the tee. Its amazing. Geoff you are more than welcome to try them out if you like. 75g grafloy pro launch shaft REG flex

I can meet you at haime this week, i think you would love them

[scanner_66]

I play a set of evolution frequency matched irons in regular flex (graphite), I hit the 9 iron 145 carry, very high ball flight with a tremendous amount of back spin. I hit into a green the other day and the 9 iron spun back 10-12 feet. It is not abnormal to have back spin from my 5 iron.

As mentioned above the tendancy for these irons is to shut the face fast and pull left. When I use my friends X14 pros with 6.0 rifles I hit a much more "pleasant trajectory" that is boring and still has lots of spin.

I started with the evolutions when I switched from left to right handed 2 years ago, they were awesome irons when I needed a forgiving iron that had some playability. I have dropped 10 strokes this year (11.9) and am still taking 35-40 putts per bad round. That is not 2 putting most, it is 3 and 4 putting erratically!

All that to say I think if you want club help from going right and need higher ball flight go to a softer shaft as stated so well above.

My 2 cents worth.

Geoff

[downhillslider]

I did an experiment the other day with a customer. He presently has 5.0's in his irons with a very flat swing, hence a low trajectory robbing him of distance. Like with all my fittings, I always begin with soft shafts an incramentaly increase stiffness until we reach a point where it is obvious that they can't hit that particular one and the start backing off to zero in on the correct one. I put a 2.5 in his hands. The result was a high balloning shot. Yes it was a softer shaft, but it was a softer shaft over all, not just the tip section. The butt was very soft compared to the 5.0 wich dramaticly affected the trajectory. Point beeing, you must assess the profile of the shaft and not just the the so called designated flex.The conclusion to my experiment was that a 4.0 was closer to what he required but I recommended another product in the end to better match a profile to his swing.

[Big Johnny69]

I did an experiment the other day with a customer. He presently has 5.0's in his irons with a very flat swing, hence a low trajectory robbing him of distance. Like with all my fittings, I always begin with soft shafts an incramentaly increase stiffness until we reach a point where it is obvious that they can't hit that particular one and the start backing off to zero in on the correct one. I put a 2.5 in his hands. The result was a high balloning shot. Yes it was a softer shaft, but it was a softer shaft over all, not just the tip section. The butt was very soft compared to the 5.0 wich dramaticly affected the trajectory. Point beeing, you must assess the profile of the shaft and not just the the so called designated flex.The conclusion to my experiment was that a 4.0 was closer to what he required but I recommended another product in the end to better match a profile to his swing.

Interesting. Well we'll see what happens Friday.

[BC MIST]

I'm not worried about OB left, but if I can get the ball flight straightened out some, that would be great.

By inference you are hitting the ball a certain amount to the right (and the ball should be straight to going more left) and are looking for a shaft that will compensate for this flight pattern If this is so, then there is a swing problem and making a small adjustment to your top hand grip, or perhaps your alignment, may be all that is needed.

While I understand the concept of "it's the club, not me," I believe that more progress is made when I realize that "it's me, not the club." Although club makers like the former train of thought.

[scanner_66]

Geoff, I may be crazy but those Wilsons I got from you seem very upright to me. I will try and get them checked or at least compare the mto some new standard ones and see what I can determine. As they were the only irons you have broke 70 with this may be something to keep in mind going forward.

Does anyone know if there is a place in Kingston that can measure the loft and lie of irons.

Geoff