Consistency!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mberube]

What makes us more and more consistent? I’m beginning to question someone ability to consistently swing the club a certain way. Can you be consistent only if you have that timing in you or what ever you want to call it? Why is that you can swing perfectly one day and then completely lose it a few day later. Does someone need to have a special talent to constantly swing the swing he has and knows how to swing it day in day out?

I’m babbling here but looking back in my handicap grid I see one round of 68 followed by an 87 on the same course and two day apart. I also see 85-75-72-75-87. There is something seriously wrong with this picture. Note that I am not whining, I’m just questioning the ability for someone to play with consistency. I understand that some of you would kill to play these rounds but I’m talking about consistence at any level.

It boggles my mind that I can swing the club so perfectly and then the next day I seem to have no clue what I’m doing. Why is that? Is there something that the pros have, an internal timing mechanism that we don’t and will never have?

I’m wondering if I will ever be a consistent player no mater how perfectly I swing the club. I’m refraining myself from entering regional tournaments because of this. I don’t have the confidence that my swing will hold-up two or more rounds.

I invite anyone who has a comment on my questioning.

Mike

[spackler]

What makes us more and more consistent? I’m beginning to question someone ability to consistently swing the club a certain way. Can you be consistent only if you have that timing in you or what ever you want to call it? Why is that you can swing perfectly one day and then completely lose it a few day later. Does someone need to have a special talent to constantly swing the swing he has and knows how to swing it day in day out?

I’m babbling here but looking back in my handicap grid I see one round of 68 followed by an 87 on the same course and two day apart. I also see 85-75-72-75-87. There is something seriously wrong with this picture. Note that I am not whining, I’m just questioning the ability for someone to play with consistency. I understand that some of you would kill to play these rounds but I’m talking about consistence at any level.

It boggles my mind that I can swing the club so perfectly and then the next day I seem to have no clue what I’m doing. Why is that? Is there something that the pros have, an internal timing mechanism that we don’t and will never have?

I’m wondering if I will ever be a consistent player no mater how perfectly I swing the club. I’m refraining myself from entering regional tournaments because of this. I don’t have the confidence that my swing will hold-up two or more rounds.

I invite anyone who has a comment on my questioning.

Mike

I'd bet anything the bolded part is key. If you have the swing to shoot a 68, it's probably your mind that's letting you shoot an 87. I know when I look back at a bad round it's almost always because my confidence got shaken at some point and I started making adjustments where I maybe didn't need to make any.

Have you tried the ClearKeys method that BC and others promote? Seems to me you just need to get your head out of the way of your swing.

[mberube]

I have tried clear key and It’s not for me. I personally don’t think it’s a mind thing. I think or very rarely think of anything mechanical about the swing on the course and never ever try to change anything on the course. I think it’s a timing issue or a physical aspect of the swing. Out of the blue I get this feeling in my swing and it’s like I can’t feel a thing. I just can’t put my finger on it and I’m pretty sure I’m not the only one out there.

Consistency is something that we all thrive for but how do we attain it? Does a perfect swing automatically give you consistency? Are we all practicing for nothing?

Mike

[Txxxxxxx]

How often do you practice? I agree that the mental aspect of the game is probably one of the causes of your inconsistency, but muscle memory also plays a part.

The other thing to think about is the fact it's not only amateurs that have one great, then one poor round. I mean the spread in strokes you're talking about obviously doesn't happen, but they might shoot 65 then 72.

[mberube]

Oh ya, the comment in bold. When I say confidence I relate that to consistency. I’m not confident that I can play good consecutive tournament rounds. I don’t mean that I am not confident in my game.

[MusicMan]

it means having confidence, and paracticing to the full of your ability.

example, i did a fitting the other day for lie angle.
i gave him a:
STD lie. he hit it off the toe.
1 up. off the toe in the same spot
2 up off the toe in the same spot
3 up off the toe in the same spot
4 up! off the toe in the same spot

then for fun.
1 flat. off the toe in the same spot
2 flat off the toe in the same spot
3 flat off the toe in the same spot

and this person claimed to be a consistant golfer. he coulda just been having a bad day and lost all his consistancy....

[mberube]

How often do you practice? I agree that the mental aspect of the game is probably one of the causes of your inconsistency, but muscle memory also plays a part.

The other thing to think about is the fact it's not only amateurs that have one great, then one poor round. I mean the spread in strokes you're talking about obviously doesn't happen, but they might shoot 65 then 72.

I practice more then I play. Practice short game a lot at least one hour 4-5 times a week. Actually I’m the VJ at my course.

I don’t want to turn this in to a “Me” thread. I was just taking my game as an example. Are you guys telling me that you are consistent day in day out? If so I envy that. What are your last 10-15 scores?

I play fearless golf. When I set up to the ball I want no bad thoughts or fear of ether side of the fairway, hazard…. I see and feel nothing other then my target.

[rezadue]

Mike,

While not nearly an accomplished golf as you, I have the exact same issues. My last few round in reverse order have been: 103-94-102-90-86-100

For me the two major source of problems are swing tempo (espcially in the back swing) and concentration. Some days while standing over the ball I can't clear my head and thing of nothing or just one thing. And at the same time while I know I have to have a smooth back swing to make solid contact, I can't repeat it when actually stepping up to the ball.

Both mental. Both frustrating as hell.

I practice more then I play. Practice short game a lot at least one hour 4-5 times a week. Actually I’m the VJ at my course.

I don’t want to turn this in to a “Me” thread. I was just taking my game as an example. Are you guys telling me that you are consistent day in day out? If so I envy that. What are your last 10-15 scores?

I play fearless golf. When I set up to the ball I want no bad thoughts or fear of ether side of the fairway, hazard…. I see and feel nothing other then my target.

[Started2k3]

mberube
I think everyone deals with consistency in some way.

Now on to you. Have you compared your 70s and 80s rounds to see if there is a common theme.

Stats make the comparison a lot easier, but do you keep them?

Certain pin positions:
- may suit your approach shots (plays to your draw or fade) so GIRs would be up a little
- you can read the green better from one side of the green than another (chips and first putts closer to the hole)

[Txxxxxxx]

I practice more then I play. Practice short game a lot at least one hour 4-5 times a week. Actually I’m the VJ at my course.

I don’t want to turn this in to a “Me” thread. I was just taking my game as an example. Are you guys telling me that you are consistent day in day out? If so I envy that. What are your last 10-15 scores?

I play fearless golf. When I set up to the ball I want no bad thoughts or fear of ether side of the fairway, hazard…. I see and feel nothing other then my target.

I don't practice nearly as much as you. In fact, I've only been to the range and practice green right before my rounds this season. My game obviously suffers because of that, but mostly the higher score part of it. I'm used to shooting low 70's, not high 70's and low 80's. My last 10-15 rounds have all been within 5 strokes of each other. I've had a low of 76 and high of 81.

These rounds of course have been on different courses, which obviously makes a difference. Unless you're actually playing the same course all the time, it's pretty hard to measure consistency in my opinion.

[mberube]

mberube
I think everyone deals with consistency in some way.

Now on to you. Have you compared your 70s and 80s rounds to see if there is a common theme.

Stats make the comparison a lot easier, but do you keep them?

Certain pin positions:
- may suit your approach shots (plays to your draw or fade) so GIRs would be up a little
- you can read the green better from one side of the green than another (chips and first putts closer to the hole)

Exactly, everyone suffers from consistency in there own way. Why is that and how do you narrow that inconsistency? What makes someone more consistent? Are you born with something that some don’t have?

Your point is interesting but I’m not suffering from game plan issues. I’m talking about mechanical issues. Not feeling the same swing on a given day.

[mberube]

I don't practice nearly as much as you. In fact, I've only been to the range and practice green right before my rounds this season. My game obviously suffers because of that, but mostly the higher score part of it. I'm used to shooting low 70's, not high 70's and low 80's. My last 10-15 rounds have all been within 5 strokes of each other. I've had a low of 76 and high of 81.

These rounds of course have been on different courses, which obviously makes a difference. Unless you're actually playing the same course all the time, it's pretty hard to measure consistency in my opinion.

I play 90% of my rounds at my home course. That’s what makes it so frustrating. You can really see the inconsistency up close.

[Started2k3]

Exactly, everyone suffers from consistency in there own way. Why is that and how do you narrow that inconsistency? What makes someone more consistent? Are you born with something that some don’t have?

Your point is interesting but I’m not suffering from game plan issues. I’m talking about mechanical issues. Not feeling the same swing on a given day.

One thing that suddenly came to mind was the Canadian Open a few years ago where VJ and Weir had to play the 18th again in a playoff. VJ at the time was so consistent, it appeared that in during the playoff hole his ball was lying in the exact same spot that was 15mins earlier! I remember thinking "I hope his caddy replaced the divot properly." Weir did what seems like his usual of a 40yd difference from first and second time through the 18th.

So here you have one of the most consistent strikers and the most streaky strikers (IMO - Weir can go from low 60s to 80s in back to back rounds) on the tour. If we could answer why these two players are so different in their consistency then we might find that we have the answer to you question.

What do you think?

[mberube]

One thing that suddenly came to mind was the Canadian Open a few years ago where VJ and Weir had to play the 18th again in a playoff. VJ at the time was so consistent, it appeared that in during the playoff hole his ball was lying in the exact same spot that was 15mins earlier! I remember thinking "I hope his caddy replaced the divot properly." Weir did what seems like his usual of a 40yd difference from first and second time through the 18th.

So here you have one of the most consistent strikers and the most streaky strikers (IMO - Weir can go from low 60s to 80s in back to back rounds) on the tour. If we could answer why these two players are so different in their consistency then we might find that we have the answer to you question.

What do you think?

Hmmmm!! That is interesting. I don’t know what to say! The only thing that comes to mind is “nerves” in Mike’s case. But it still makes me wonder how could he have lost his mojo that day, other then nerve.

It’s a question that might never be answered but it’s worth exploring cause I think it’s the #1 thing in golf that is extremely vague. All the pros make their student believe perfect practice makes you more consistent. Is that true or just BS???

[Kilroy]

Vijay is a practice machine. The above example of Vijay and Mike Weir may just answer your question.

[Started2k3]

"Nerves"?

Canadian Open 2004
VJ: 68-66-72-69 (playoff winner)
MW: 68-65-70-72

Maybe.

[mberube]

Dan, you think practice makes you consistent? I practice a lot. Probably more then the average amateur golfer and probably more then low single digit handicapper at least the ones that I know. One thing that does come to mind is the amount of games I play. I only play twice a week. Plying more maybe the key to consistency…

I believe that practicing the right thinks gives you the tools to shoot lower and lower but I’m not sure it gives you consistency.

Mike

[mberube]

"Nerves"?

Canadian Open 2004
VJ: 68-66-72-69 (playoff winner)
MW: 68-65-70-72

Maybe.

If I recall correctly Mike missed more then his share of putts on the back 9 and during the playoff on that Sunday.

[Bullet]

Well I've been consistant as of late....all terrible rounds LOL I hit my worst round since really taking golf as a sport, not a outing. As for me it's usually been my long game that has been hurting me. My short game is usually stable with the level of play I'm at. I must say that everytime I's at the tee or choose a FW I'm not confident. The results are there. I am hitting the woods much more when I do practice but lack of time to practice is a big issue for me.

[Started2k3]

If I recall correctly Mike missed more then his share of putts on the back 9 and during the playoff on that Sunday.

The putts didn't really matter on the playoff hole. VJ was in the middle of the fairway at almost the same spot as 15mins earlier (I can't remember exactly but I think VJ did the same thing twice - back fringe) while Mike was in the left hand side rough after his tee shot and I think (don't quote me) the first time he was on the fairway.

I don't think VJ is really known for his putting ability - he is good but he can 3-putt from 6' with the best of them.

[soulman]

Dan, you think practice makes you consistent? I practice a lot. Probably more then the average amateur golfer and probably more then low single digit handicapper at least the ones that I know. One thing that does come to mind is the amount of games I play. I only play twice a week. Plying more maybe the key to consistency…

I believe that practicing the right thinks gives you the tools to shoot lower and lower but I’m not sure it gives you consistency.

Mike

Take a few days off, go on a vacation with your girls...breath in, breath out. All will be good Mike!

[Pinshark]

I feel your pain went 38-45 yesterday for a solid 83. previous three rounds 79 83 96(OUCH a four putt and 6 three putts this day)

[mberube]

Take a few days off, go on a vacation with your girls...breath in, breath out. All will be good Mike!

Seb???

[mberube]

Take a few days off, go on a vacation with your girls...breath in, breath out. All will be good Mike!

It is you. Checked your profile. It must not be busy in the Calgary taxe world for you to post here….

[jeffc]

you're talking to a guy that shot 92 on sunday and 74 on monday. Two different courses, one tight with small greens, the other open with large greens. Slope is about the same. Putted well and hit driver well in both. Took a nine in the 92 round trying to hack out a ball from a hazard. Irons were the difference, I didn't chunk any, flub any chips in the 74 and didn't have anything more than a 5 (or bogey) on the card. I also got some good bounces (and a few not so good) As to what it is I am baffled as to why my irons are good one day and lousy the next.

[mberube]

you're talking to a guy that shot 92 on sunday and 74 on monday. Two different courses, one tight with small greens, the other open with large greens. Slope is about the same. Putted well and hit driver well in both. Took a nine in the 92 round trying to hack out a ball from a hazard. Irons were the difference, I didn't chunk any, flub any chips in the 74 and didn't have anything more than a 5 (or bogey) on the card. I also got some good bounces (and a few not so good) As to what it is I am baffled as to why my irons are good one day and lousy the next.

That is exactly what I mean. Lost and found swings. Why is that?

I posted scores only to show the difference between good and bad rounds. Scores reflect every aspect of the game and that is not what I am talking about. I’m wondering what makes player A repeat his swing perfectly every round and minimize his mistakes? I can’t and I’m trying to find out why!!!!!

I’m trying to grasp on what makes a player consistent. Everyone has a bad round here and there. That’s part of golf. Having a bad round every 4 or 5 rounds is insane. I’m surely not the only one battling this issue and there is surely more players out there that are consistent…..

[Hank Hill]

I am convinced putting is the key to good scores. I know it sounds rather obvious but bear with me. If you are putting well you feel like you can hole out from anywhere on the green, approach shots, chips and pitches then have much less pressure on them as the flat stick is on fire, the result, you relax and hit them close anyway.

When putting is off, the rest of the game is effected, you now try extra hard to get it close with approach shots, chips and pitches as you don't want to leave long putts as anything over 20 feet might get you into 3 putt territory, the result, you tense up and end up putting the ball in 3 putt territory. On the odd occasion it can get so bad that you start trying to land your tee shots to specific distances so to make the approach easier, to make the putt easier, more pressure.

Putting is key!

[byerxa]

I really wonder how inconsistent we are relative. How does it look when you compare your net score adjusted properly for the slope? If you compare the deviations of these scores relative to par to an average pro's deviations (not buddy winning that weekend), is it really that far off? Everything tends to be relative in golf, not absolute.

Also, as another poster suggested, putting it a huge part. I find when I score well, I am not necessarily hitting great shots, but I am keeping it in play and I will sink a pile of 6-10 footers. What was a 79 can easily become an 85 with 6 missed putts. My problem is I do not have the short game to deal with the off days. I try too hard to ball strike since I have no confidence in my scoring game. I have to learn on the off days to suck it up and simply focus on keeping the ball in play.

[mberube]

I totally agree that putting is key. Bad putting will put pressure on your short game all the way back to the tee box. Although I think bad putting will result in a bad stretch of rounds that will eventually lead to a slump. I don’t think that putting badly for one round will affect your game to the point of losing your swing in one out 3-4 rounds. Like jeff said “As to what it is I am baffled as to why my irons are good one day and lousy the next”

That’s just my opinion.

[jvincent]

What makes us more and more consistent?

.... Good questions snipped .....

I invite anyone who has a comment on my questioning.

If you could find the answer to your first question and bottle it, you be a billionaire.

I think you need to first define what consistency is since it will vary based on a player to player basis.

For arguement's sake, let's define any differential within one standard deviation of my average as being statistically irrelevant. Whether or not one SDEV is the right number I don't know but you get the idea.

Then you need to factor in the time/aging factor. If I take my scores going all the way back to when I started playing, that's not indicative. Nor are rounds at the beginning of the season when you haven't swung a golf club in 4 months.

As to why we are inconsistent, there are so many factors in golf. Physical ones such as playing conditions, injuries, hangovers (which I hear was a problem this weekend ), etc. Throw in the environmental conditions; hot, cold, windy, rain, and the ever present mental side; pissed at wife/kids/work/dog/traffic and you get what you get. Scores that vary. The further away from scratch you get, the bigger the variation too.

Now, if any of us here actually played golf for a living it would be a different story. Dedicating 40+ hours a week will definitely help your consistency if for no other reason than confidence breeds consistency. Fear of hitting a bad shot almost always results in a bad shot.