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Thread: Casual water in rough
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06-02-2003 10:54 AM #1
- Join Date
- Oct 2002
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- Barrhaven
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Casual water in rough
With all the rain we've had in the last week or so, the question came up as to casual water in the rough. Are you allowed relief if your ball comes to rest in casual or standing water in the rough. Some say you have to play it as it is and some say you do get relief. If you can get relief, is it one club length, two or is it the nearest point of relief no closer to the hole?. Do you have to take the drop in the rough or can you drop it in the fairway (so long as it is no closer to the hole) ?
Any thoughts?putterking
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06-02-2003 11:24 AM #2
There is no distinction in the Rules between "rough" and "fairway".
You get free relief from casual water anywhere except in a hazard.
Interference by an abnormal ground condition ( casual water) occurs when a ball lies in or touches the condition or when such a condition interferes with the player’s stance or the area of his intended swing.
Free relief is always one club length.
You determine your nearest point of relief from the casual water.
You drop the ball without penalty:
1. Within one club length of this point AND
2. Not back in the casual water AND
3. Not in a hazard AND
4. Not on a putting green AND
5. Not nearer the hole
As long as you satisfy all the above conditions, you may or may not be in the rough or on the fairway.
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06-02-2003 01:54 PM #3
- Join Date
- Oct 2001
- Posts
- 259
I am not trying to give the impression that many of my fellow competitors cheat in tournaments, however, a situation arose one time that I would like to get clarification about.
When water lies in a puddle it is obviously casual water. But, if the ground is just saturated, and water is not visible, is the player permitted to push his foot hard on the ground or tap his foot in order to make the water come to the surface? I have seen this happen.
It seems to me that if a player is walking normally or fairly taking his stance, that if water does not come to the surface, it is NOT casual, even though the ground may be very wet. Forcing water to the surface is looking for an unfair advantage, IMO.
This could also apply to the putting green where the roll of the ball is greatly affected by casual water.
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06-02-2003 03:05 PM #4
Stance on Casual Water
The player is allowed to take reasonable actions to illustrate "casual water". The problem comes around when the 250 pound gorilla can get casual water with just a step, whereas the 180 gorilla cannot.
Anyhow, it's like "how long do you leave a ball hanging on the lip of the cup?" type of situations. When I see someone obviously "trying to establish casual water", I walk over to them and see what splashes. I'm neither the 180 pound nor the 250 pound gorilla, and with a nod-wink, I say "hmm, got water trouble???"
Now, if the guy's all by himself and you see him doing the "casual water" dance, may want to have him verify with *someone* that is around, before making a call. I'm a stickler for getting a 2nd opinion...
On the otherhand, we're suppose to be "gentlemen" and take him at his word, right?
Just my thoughts,
A question: Will this person (or the two from the ball-marking question in another thread) be competing for the Ottawa Citizen Amateur Championship?
Cheers,
DonH
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06-02-2003 05:25 PM #5
Casual water has nothing to do with a casual water dance.
Casual water is any temporary accumulation of water on the course which is visible before or after the player takes his stance and is not in a water hazard.
So, if the player is in position to play the stroke (static, no moving) and you cannot see casual water at his feet or under the ball, there is no relief.
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06-02-2003 06:19 PM #6
As the 250 pound gorilla, and that point drives Steve crazy that I can get water around my shoes where he can't, when does casual water appearing start. Does water have to be a puddle, or can me standing there, static as you say Gary, cause water to accumulate along the tops of the soles of my shoes? I can step in a soggy ground, sink down and get the tops of my shoes wet from water gooshing out of the wet ground. You can't see it when I'm not standing there.
And to clarify what you mentioned earlier Gary, if I am in the first cut of rough, and the closest point of relief is on the fairway, can I drop there as long as I am no nearer the hole, not on the green, and not in a hazard?It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.
Colby
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06-02-2003 07:05 PM #7
The wording of the Rules is very specific and means EXACTLY what it says.
If you get relief from a spot where a lighter person would not, then good for you.
The Rule says nothing about your shoes being wet.
The Rule does say that if you take your stance and can SEE water, then you get relief. No more, no less.
Other than a single sentence for the explanation of "closely-mown area" as it applies only to the Embedded Ball Rule, the words rough, 1st cut, 2nd cut, and fairway are not found in the Rules.
So, yes, you would be permitted to drop, as you put it, "on the fairway".
Under the Rules, there are only 4 types of areas on a golf course.
1. The teeing ground of the hole being played.
2. The putting green of the hole being played.
3. All hazards on the course.
4. Through the green.
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06-02-2003 07:11 PM #8Originally posted by Gary Hill
Under the Rules, there are only 4 types of areas on a golf course.
1. The teeing ground of the hole being played.
2. The putting green of the hole being played.
3. All hazards on the course.
4. Through the green.
Thanks again Gary.It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.
Colby
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