Swing Change

[moochie]

After fighting an Over the Top, Hit Reflex type swing for 4 years, I have decided to take the winter and make a swing change using a single axis type swing. I have been making good progress but have following question for the forum: Should I practice with only one club until the new swing is ingrained?

The reason I ask is that I have been using a 7 iron with good success. Being a man with an ego, I constantly long for more length so have been trying a longer iron (4 iron) with mixed results. This seems to throw off my timing that carries into the 7 iron for a few swings.

Thoughts/suggestions appreciated.

Mike

[BigFlopper]

Mike,

When I'm doing swing changes, I work with mid clubs (5,6,7) for most of the time, but change to a harder-to-hit club (4 and longer) once in a while as a bit of a test to see how things are going. I find with the shorter clubs it's easy to get a tempo/timing that is too fast or off for the longer clubs. Plus, you don't want to groove a swing for one club.

Frank

After fighting an Over the Top, Hit Reflex type swing for 4 years, I have decided to take the winter and make a swing change using a single axis type swing. I have been making good progress but have following question for the forum: Should I practice with only one club until the new swing is ingrained?

The reason I ask is that I have been using a 7 iron with good success. Being a man with an ego, I constantly long for more length so have been trying a longer iron (4 iron) with mixed results. This seems to throw off my timing that carries into the 7 iron for a few swings.

Thoughts/suggestions appreciated.

Mike

[byerxa]

It will take a while to get your long irons going with the new swing. IMO long irons are the hardest clubs to hit. They will tend to make you want to fall back into your old ways more than any other club. I'd work the other way and spend some time hitting 1/2 and 3/4 wedges to work on the impact position more.

[BC MIST]

I have decided to take the winter and make a swing change using a single axis type swing. I have been making good progress but have following question for the forum: Should I practice with only one club until the new swing is ingrained?

The reason I ask is that I have been using a 7 iron with good success. Being a man with an ego, I constantly long for more length so have been trying a longer iron (4 iron) with mixed results. This seems to throw off my timing that carries into the 7 iron for a few swings.

Having converted to a single axis swing, now 11 years ago, I partly understand the dilemma that you are going through. As mentioned above, the long irons are the hardest clubs to hit so I would avoid them just now. Instead, I would go to a lofted fairway wood, say a 5 wood, which will increase the challenge of your newly learned fundamentals because of the shaft length, but still be easy enough to hit because of the increased loft.

Your progress will be slower than some solely because of the over the top motion that you previously had. Regardless of method, this fault takes a lot longer to eradicate. However, the rewards down the line are worth the wait. You will hit the ball straighter/more consistently and when you get the club head path coming from the inside, YOU will hit it farther because your previous OTT swing is a distance thief.

Even though I noticed improvement indoors immediately, it took 4 months of daily practice and three times a week of hitting balls, to get to the point where I believed that the change I made was the right one to do, and to do it without having to use conscious swing thoughts.

A single axis swing is not a magical solution to swing problems, however, it is easier to get the club on the proper path/plane and without all the contortions of a traditional swing, facing the ball at impact with everything you own, makes it easier to get the club face square. The real difficulty of any swing change is not learning something new, but in replacing the old bad habits. It can be done, the rewards are greater, but it takes time. Be patient. A single axis swing is like sex: when it's good, it's very good, but when it's bad, it's still good.

Are you following anyone's single axis method? If not, I have a suggestion. Good luck.

[moochie]

Following the practices of Don "swing Surgeon" Trahan. Saw him on the golf channel and gave his method a try with good results. Any other suggestions are appreciated.

[leftylucas]

Moochie, I changed my swing last year after I saw Jim Hardy on TGC and decided to learn more. I read his book and felt comfortable that I was a good candidate to be a single-axis type player. I then contacted Pat Laderoute at the suggestion of BC Mist and this is where I feel was the best step toward success. With Pat I was assessed and he worked on my set-up (That was amazing) and then we worked on the swing change. I saw him every week for 6 weeks in the winter (DOME) and in the spring I saw him again when I thought my old habits were crepping back in. I practiced with a 7 iron at his insistance until he thought I had the swing down OK.

Like BC Mist wrote, It took a lot of practice to be happy with the results but it was well worth it. Kepp taking lessons to make sure your swing develops correctly. It helped me a great deal

good luck and keep us posted on your progress

[BC MIST]

;154553 I have decided to take the winter and make a swing change using a single axis type swing.

Correct me if I am wrong, but my comments were based on taking your literally, when you said that you were changing to a SINGLE AXIS swing. Is it possible that you are changing to a SINGLE PLANE swing? If so, then they have characteristics that are very, very different.

[moochie]

Forgive my ignorance but what is the difference? And, more importantly, what are the benefits/limitations of each?

[BC MIST]

Forgive my ignorance but what is the difference? And, more importantly, what are the benefits/limitations of each?

Single Plane - is NOT single plane. It refers to the position at the top, looking from down the line, where your left arm is parallel to or coincides with your turned shoulder plane. http://www.golfbetterproductions.com/the-swing.asp Look at the second pic down. The TRUTH is that the hands move back along the shaft axis plane(white line) and then move UP along a second plane to the top of the backswing. This is called a plane shift and really shows that this swing should NOT be called single plane, but it is. So be it. This is a better swing motion than the "Double Plane" swing.

Currently, this swing is being popularized by Jim Hardy who has a informercial on TGN, a book and I gather DVD's. The swing concept is good, however, the rest of Jim Hardy's instruction in the book, IMO, is NOT very good. A better book is John Dunnigan's "The Secret of The Golf Swing," which actually tells the truth about the "single plane" swing and shows you a lot better, what and how to get into the ideal positions. You can find the info about this at John's website. www.golfbetterproductions.com. Again, IMO. it is EXCELLENT.

Single Axis - refers to an position when again looking down the line. A line drawn along the shaft and along the lower right arm forms a straight line or single axis. Moe Norman was an example of a single axis player, whose swing was as close to a true single plane as anyone's. The grip of the lower hand is more across the palm than along the base of the fingers in a traditional swing. If you look at a traditional setup from this same view, the angle formed by the shaft and the right arm forms an obtuse angle. You can find shots of Moe's position at www.swinglikemoe.com in the instructional area - "key positions of Moe Norman's swing."

The "single plane" is flatter, and the plane shift both going back and coming down is much smaller so it is easier to be consistent. What Dunnigan has you do, in a very simple way, ENSURES an inside path to the ball which is what you want to achieve. Hardy's stuff has a lot of traditional mumbo jumbo. Others will disagree.

A single axis swing attempts to keep your hands on ONE plane going both back and through with a lot less plane shifting that the method above. The bottom grip is in the palm so the rotation through the ball takes place over a longer distance. The body almost faces the ball at impact versus "clearing the hips" of a traditional swing. This also increases consistency. The right foot is flat on the ground at impact, preventing the body from rotating too early.

I played 35 years with a traditional swing and now 11 with the single axis swing and there is no doubt that the latter is better in terms of accuracy and equivalent in terms of distance. However, it looks unusual at address and many golfers don't want to look different/goofy. There is some excellent instruction available with the material at the Graves brothers website www.swinglikemoe.com. They teach Moe's swing. This is not to be confused with Natural Golf, which while very similar, has some aspects unlike Moe Norman's swing. Supper time.

[moochie]

Thanks for your time BC. I tried using Dunnigan's approach for a few years but struggled with pushing the club back and down. The technique I am currently trying to learn has simplified things quite a bit and I am hitting the ball more consistently.

[leftylucas]

Well I also struggled with that same back and down move Moochie but one day it just kinda clicked and it has made a world of difference for me. The Hardy teachings is definitely different from Dunnigan and Pat Laderoute thought me the Dunnigan method. I found that if I used a badminton racquet I could mimic the move much better and this indoor practice helped greatly. The one thing that I found was that although my backswing was much shorter that my distance did not suffer.

[Gangrel]

Is Pat still working out of Cedar Hill? I got his email adress last year, but didn't go for lessons for various reasons, but would like to this spring.

Is it still pat @ cedarhill.com?

[Wknd_Warrior]

I don't think it matters, theres pros and cons to both sides. What is importand is you scrapped the old and took on the new, not easy on the ego, so cheers.