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Thread: Best Club to be a member at.
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08-03-2006 12:20 PM #91
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This is an interesting thread, there are some fundamental questions to ask about what type of club/membership you are looking for.
Are you looking for a private club membership or a cheaper per round playing pass? Do you want to entertain clients, does prestige factor matter, have a place where you would actually have a meal at without playing golf, what type of service do you expect, course accessibility, location, clubhouse, number of outside tournaments etc.
The first thing you will hear from a member at courses like Ottawa Hunt, Royal Ottawa, Camelot, Rivermead is how much they enjoy their golf courses. From Clublink Ottawa members, normally the first thing you usually hear is all the other courses they can play for free. Speaking only for myself, I don’t get tired of playing Ottawa Hunt and I know members at the other clubs mentioned say the same about theirs. The fact I can play top end private courses in Montreal and Toronto for free is a secondary benefit.
I’ve played all the Clublink Ottawa courses several times. I don’t hate them, don’t love them, am just indifferent. They are not terrible but nothing special. I enjoy playing them mainly because I get to spend some time with my friends who are members there. To each their own, but off the top of my head, the 4 do not rate in the top ten in Ottawa, maybe one or two at most.
The only reason to join Kanata Lakes at 22,500 for initiation, over the Hunt, Royal or Camelot for close to the same price, would be for location if you live in Kanata. It’s a pretty good golf course offset by a terrible layout in a housing development.
Greyhawk is in the middle. You could go cheaper with an annual pass at a public/semi-private course or a bit more expensive with Rivermead, Rideauview. From the times I’ve been out there, the service has been quite good and friendly.
Both places host a large number of outside tournaments, especially for private clubs.
Le Maitre is great and I’ve heard good things about the Muskoka courses, but even if I vacation in both places, 90% of my rounds are played here in Ottawa and being able to play there for free doesn’t offset the benefit I receive from playing a better course 90% of the time. Of course I still can go play these courses, I just have to pay.
All that being said, I certainly see the benefits of joining Clublink but it is more the sum of all parts making up for the average golf courses in Ottawa compared to other private clubs. The benefit of being able to play at different courses is not as big of a factor when you belong to a great course.
Last edited by DewDuster; 08-03-2006 at 12:55 PM.
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08-04-2006 12:03 AM #92
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Originally Posted by jonf
If you play a variety of courses and travel 40-60 minutes to get to any of the courses, the fact that you can play 7 courses (and not pay green fees) located within a 90 minute drive is significant. There are courses in Ottawa better than the Clublink courses and Clubhouses far more spectacular than any of the Clublink ones but in terms of getting your money's worth there is no contest.
I have played 8 rounds at Le Maitre ($105 green fee), 2 at Fontainebleau ($100 green fee), 11 in Toronto (average $120 green fee) that equates to roughly $2300 in green fees I would have paid. Not to mention the 30+ rounds I have shot at the Ottawa courses.
Am I pleased with my choice of membership? Damn right! But don't insult me by alleging that I think anyone is beneath me. That, my friend, is NOT how I think at all...
Originally Posted by EdmontonGolferLast edited by MrMulligan; 08-04-2006 at 12:16 AM.
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08-04-2006 02:23 AM #93Originally Posted by MrMulligan
Dewduster explains it very well. He's basically summed up my thoughts. I don't think that 80% of private course members, lets say Hunt Club or Rivermead members, joined their course because the head pro can set up reciprocal games at other courses. It's a very different atmosphere and experience compared to a public course or semi-private for that matter.
I think the other reason that ClubLink members would agree the reciprocal play was high on their list is because I can't think of one Ottawa ClubLink course that compares to Rivermead or The Hunt condition wise, or clubhouse wise, so yeah, I wouldn't want to always have to golf at that single course. It's a good deal because it combines average and a bit above average courses when you join, but if you want awesome conditions and a private course atmosphere, then ClubLink is not going to compare to a private course.
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08-04-2006 06:27 AM #94
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EG makes some good points. I was lucky enough recently to be invited out to play the Rideau View golf course and I couldn't thank the very kind member enough for inviting me out. And to sum it up in one word, AWESOME. If I had the funds to join there I can assure you I wouldn't get tired of playing that course. It is a great challenge and the conditions were phenomenal. From the staff, to the practice facility. Just a great experience. I can see the benefits of ClubLink, but I can also see how some would be more than satisfied with the private club atmosphere.
"A life lived in fear of the new and the untried is not a life lived to its fullest." M.Pare 10/09/08
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08-04-2006 09:50 AM #95
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Private golf clubs have to compete with Clublink in order to survive. I believe that is the reason for the increase in reciprocal agreements at most private clubs. People who join private clubs tend to view reciprocals as a bonus, but decide to join a club based almost exclusively on the features of the course. I have not taken advantage of the reciprocal arrangements offered by my club because it costs time and money (gas, meals, etc.) to travel to these courses. Since I love my home course, I do not feel a strong desire to play these other clubs at the present time. Perhaps when I am retired and have more time to spare, then I will be more inclined to play the courses with which we have eciprocal playing privileges.
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08-04-2006 09:58 AM #96
Again, EG is comparing courses that have been around for decades with courses that have been there less than 2, and with Greyhawk, Talon is less than 5 years old. Let's see what these courses are like in 25 years and start comparing again...
It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.
Colby
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08-04-2006 10:28 AM #97
You could be a member at renfrew for 22 years with the initiation you're quoting (DewDuster's post) for Kanata Lakes. That difference pays for a lot of gas. I reiterate my original position, Renfrew is the best for me.
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08-04-2006 11:45 AM #98Originally Posted by Colby
That being said, the question by the thread starter again is "BEST CLUB TO BE A MEMBER AT". Why would we not compare ALL courses in this case to give the guy a good idea of what there is out there? Are you saying you can only compare courses of the same age against each other when trying to find the best one to join? I don't understand your logic...
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08-04-2006 12:19 PM #99
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Colby, when I shell out a significant amount of change for an initiation fee, I want a superior home course now. I may not be here in 25 years. For that matter, it is possible that Clublink may not be here in 25 years. What guarantee do you have that they will maintain/improve the courses? I don't have that guarantee either, but at least I know that my course has operated successfully for almost 100 years and I will have a say in how the course operates in the future. I also have a certain comfort level because my private course doesn't need to generate a healthy profit to keep its shareholders happy. In my opinion, Clublink is best for those like MrMulligan that are able to play lots of games at their out-of-town courses or who plan to move to the Toronto, Mont Tremblant, or Muskoka areas in the foreseeable future.
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08-04-2006 03:19 PM #100
I for one refuse to pay out an initiation fee that you will never get back.Club LInk
is out to make money thats it. Lots of great courses in the city to join that wont break your bank account and offer top service for your buck.e.g. Outaouais , The Canadian
Eagle Creek,and the list goes on.Save your money and invest it you will be glad you did in the long run.
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08-04-2006 05:13 PM #101Originally Posted by EdmontonGolfer
Albatrossman, I didn't shell out a huge initiation fee, and I have patience. I have seen improvments every year. And do you know what the initiation is at Rivermead? I see that no-one has actually posted the numbers from there, especially since that is the course brought up most in the conversation. If we are going to compare, let's see what the numbers really say...
Marcos, there are always ways to get your money back for the initiation at Clublink...It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.
Colby
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08-04-2006 05:27 PM #102Originally Posted by Colby
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08-04-2006 11:02 PM #103
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Originally Posted by Marcos
If I left the Hunt, I would end up basically walking away from my initiation. I would get a share, which would allow me to receive my portion of proceeds of the club if it was ever dissolved and sold. Very unlikely, but still some fallback in worst case scenario as we are sitting on some prime real estate.
Most private clubs in Ottawa are like this with the exception of Camelot which is a true equity club.
Even with the Clublink loophole, probably best when considering all private courses (sans Camelot) that if you left you will kiss your initiation goodbye. You can put it on hold as a non-resident for a small fee per year in case you ever move back.
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08-05-2006 08:15 AM #104Originally Posted by DewDusterIt could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.
Colby
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08-05-2006 06:30 PM #105
Thats funny i was told when we were thinking of joining ClubLink when we were at le Dome 4 years ago that initiation was transferable to your children only.They must have changed their policy through the years .
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08-05-2006 08:06 PM #106
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The quality of the golf courses at which you may play, obviously depends on your budget. For those well heeled, the private clubs are ideal, Club link sounds great for those with a little less disposable income and so on down the financial line.
I paid $12,500 for a lifetime membership at Greensmere. We have 9 good holes, 9 less than good holes and 18 more holes under construction that will be better than the back nine we now have. The practice facility is great, food poor and I have accessability to any starting time, any day of the week.
I will pay NOTHING further till the day I die, and receive 50% discount on power carts and a 25% discount on Pro shop purchases and all food, for life. Should I decide to leave in the next few years, I will get all of my $12,500 back. ALL OF IT!
If there are no deer crossing the road I can be at the golf club in 2 minutes and I don't have to be concerned about the noise from adjacent swimming pools or back yard parties while I am putting.
It may not be Rivermead or Carleton G&YC, where I was once played as a member, but it suits my Pepsi budget and I enjoy it. Find me a better deal.
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08-05-2006 08:09 PM #107
I was not aware of these lifetime memberships at Greensmere, but if I had the disposable income to do anything big like that, I would be jumping all of that offer for sure. I think you made a good investment.
[COLOR=DarkRed]"Friends don't let friends use Internet Explorer"
[/COLOR]Kevin
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08-05-2006 08:35 PM #108Originally Posted by BC MIST
One thing that is nice about some of the courses we have out here that are public is that they are the same or better calibre than Eagle Creek without any initiation. You can join and pay a fee of $3000/year which includes use of power cart for each round and unlimited golf. It also includes signing priviledges for the clubhouse and pro shop. There are no other fees on top of that and no initiation to pay. Now THAT is a great deal if you ask me for that kind of course.
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08-05-2006 09:52 PM #109
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Colby, I believe that Rivermead has a full membership now and they are revising their initiation fee upwards. It is on the order of $10,000. Annual dues, locker room, and food/beverage are ~$4500/year. I know it sounds like a lot of money, but it costs money to maintain a course in excellent condition and keep a high quality food service year-round.
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08-05-2006 10:05 PM #110
One of the main reasons I sold my share and left Outaouais was because they reduced their initiation fee down to $1500 (spouse $1000 & Corporate $2000) That kind of rendered my share that I paid almost $8000 for pretty useless. I was very fortunate to unload it for services (interlock wallway & steps, stone flowerbeds & yard paving) as well as a few thousand in cash. I understand some shares have been selling for $3500 to $4000 lately. The other reason I left was because the increased a shareholders yearly dues up to that of a regualr member and on top of that assessed all the shareholder and additional $1500! That made being members for my wife and I way to expensive for the benefits of a 'semi-private' club.
Proud member of the 2009 OG/TGN Ryder Cup Champions
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08-05-2006 10:33 PM #111
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Originally Posted by Indio
Personally, I would much prefer a private course over a semi-private or club link style course. However, budget does play a huge part in this equation. Proximity also facors in as BC mist points out. I'm 8 minutes from Outaouais, so it makes sense.
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08-05-2006 10:44 PM #112Originally Posted by lastplaceProud member of the 2009 OG/TGN Ryder Cup Champions
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08-06-2006 12:49 AM #113Originally Posted by albatrossman
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08-06-2006 08:02 AM #114
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Originally Posted by EdmontonGolfer
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08-06-2006 10:46 AM #115Originally Posted by lastplace
Are you a member at Outaouais? I'll be in town next month for a couple of weeks and I'll be playing with another member there if you're interested in joining us. Just PM me next month and I'll get your contact details.
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08-06-2006 10:05 PM #116
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Originally Posted by EdmontonGolfer
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08-07-2006 07:49 AM #117
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Originally Posted by Indio
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08-07-2006 10:42 AM #118Originally Posted by BC MIST
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08-07-2006 11:18 AM #119Originally Posted by BC MIST
Yup, it is a true story, I lived it 12 years ago and when I recently sold my share, the purshaser had to sign a 'waiver ' agreeing that he would not make an issue over receiving 'official' documents in the language of the club.Proud member of the 2009 OG/TGN Ryder Cup Champions
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08-08-2006 09:07 AM #120Originally Posted by albatrossmanIt could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others.
Colby
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