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  1. #1
    Postaholic mcgoo is on a distinguished road
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    Graphite iron shaft

    Looking for a high quality lite graphite iron shaft with a medium to soft .370 tip.
    Installing in a TM #3 utility iron.

  2. #2
    Arrow shooter Chieflongtee is on a distinguished road Chieflongtee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcgoo
    Looking for a high quality lite graphite iron shaft with a medium to soft .370 tip.
    Installing in a TM #3 utility iron.
    Mercury Kevlar $25. stiff
    Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.
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  3. #3
    Postaholic mcgoo is on a distinguished road
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    Can't handle a stiff. Replacing a UST IROD hybrid S shaft. I want to put an iron shaft into what is a utility iron and I have a slow swing tempo.

  4. #4
    Arrow shooter Chieflongtee is on a distinguished road Chieflongtee's Avatar
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    Not that stiff. Their centre regular shaft measures 300 cpms(cycles per minute) while the stiff I am selling is 308 cpms. So a slight difference. Anyway this has been discussed at length but unless a shaft has been profiled throughout 5 different zones there is really no way of really telling how a shaft feels to a particular golfer. Put the technical jargon aside: if a shaft is tip stiff and has low torque it will feel very stiff. Obviously just the opposite if it is tip soft.
    Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.
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  5. #5
    Golf Canada Rules Official L4 BC MIST is on a distinguished road
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chieflongtee
    Not that stiff. Their centre regular shaft measures 300 cpms(cycles per minute) while the stiff I am selling is 308 cpms. So a slight difference. Anyway this has been discussed at length but unless a shaft has been profiled throughout 5 different zones there is really no way of really telling how a shaft feels to a particular golfer. Put the technical jargon aside: if a shaft is tip stiff and has low torque it will feel very stiff. Obviously just the opposite if it is tip soft.
    A simple illustration of the point above:

    The UST I-Rod Stiff wood shaft has a butt frequency of 185 cpm while the tip is 888 cpm.

    Contrast this to a very heavy, SK Fiber Tour Trac 100 STIFF, that has a butt frequency of 187 but a tip frequency of 765.

    You had better believe that these two shafts will certainly FEEL different and the stiff I-Rod tip will have an effect on the trajectory that the SK will not. And yet they are both "stiff."

    Unfortunately, so many golfer still believe that "Stiff" and "Regular" actually mean something significant, which they do not. Shaft manufacturers are making shafts that are "X stiff" in one section, while at the same time, very "senior" in another. A "stiff' shaft is not uniformly stiffer than a "regular" shaft. If everyone could actually look at the flex profile numbers of the popular shafts, the differences in frequency of similarly labelled shafts are jaw dropping and partly explain why many shafts just do not work for the golfer.

    The profile of the shaft and how it may suit your kind of swing, is hugely important.

  6. #6
    Postaholic mcgoo is on a distinguished road
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    The points made by both Chieflongtre and BC Mist that varitation between shaft flex specifications and stiffness variations within the geography of a shaft are well taken; but how do I translate these facts of shaft life into obtaining the correct shaft for my swing with this clubhead.

    Although I am a senior I know that the senior shafted Colbra irons I used last year were too wippy. And when I repaced my wippy driver shaft last year with a True Temper "Rocket" graphite in R flex my accuracy greatly improved. My new driver shaft ,YS6 type 11 is performing OK, not great.

    My best club (accuracy & consistancy), an old Powerbuilt 5 wood, has an old True Temper graphite shaft without a flex specification, kicks in the middle of the shaft more than the tip.

    I want to shaft the TM 3U to make it perform like a 3 iron (which I cannot hit) by being able to swing it as if I am swinging a fairway wood and get the accuracy of an iron. All this while using a slow backswing and a scoup downswing.

    I am currently considering getting

    Fujikura Vista Pro 70 iron shaft
    Ust IROD long iron graphite
    USt Proforce Rv2 75 graphite
    Maltby MPF Graphite iron shaft.

    Appreciate your input very much and would like to receive comments to this, pershaps irrational, analysis of my shaft requirements.

  7. #7
    Arrow shooter Chieflongtee is on a distinguished road Chieflongtee's Avatar
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    if you don't get fitted by a competent clubfitter then your guess is as good as ours. Trial and error. The Maltby would not be a costly trial as I believe it sells for less than 15 bucks. You could also consider the Advent shaft by Rapport(all filament wound=very stable)
    http://www.golfworks.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_RA201201
    or the Precision FM Graphite(frequency matched)
    http://www.golfworks.com/product.asp_Q_pn_E_RP201201
    Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.
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  8. #8
    Golf Canada Rules Official L4 BC MIST is on a distinguished road
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    Quote Originally Posted by mcgoo
    The points made by both Chieflongtre and BC Mist that varitation between shaft flex specifications and stiffness variations within the geography of a shaft are well taken; but how do I translate these facts of shaft life into obtaining the correct shaft for my swing with this clubhead.

    Although I am a senior I know that the senior shafted Colbra irons I used last year were too wippy. And when I repaced my wippy driver shaft last year with a True Temper "Rocket" graphite in R flex my accuracy greatly improved. My new driver shaft ,YS6 type 11 is performing OK, not great.

    My best club (accuracy & consistancy), an old Powerbuilt 5 wood, has an old True Temper graphite shaft without a flex specification, kicks in the middle of the shaft more than the tip.

    I want to shaft the TM 3U to make it perform like a 3 iron (which I cannot hit) by being able to swing it as if I am swinging a fairway wood and get the accuracy of an iron. All this while using a slow backswing and a scoup downswing.

    I am currently considering getting

    Fujikura Vista Pro 70 iron shaft
    Ust IROD long iron graphite
    USt Proforce Rv2 75 graphite
    Maltby MPF Graphite iron shaft.

    Appreciate your input very much and would like to receive comments to this, pershaps irrational, analysis of my shaft requirements.
    Consider this: To select a suitable shaft for any club in your bag, you need to consider what your backswing to downswing speed is, what your downswing tempo is, what the release of your wrsit cock angle is and the swing speed of your driver, for wood shaft selection and your 5 iron, for iron shaft selection. This has nothing to do with whether you are a "senior" or not. What is a senior, anyway? Over 65, over 55, over 60? I played with a "senior" yesterday who consistently drove the ball in the 275 to 290 yard range.

    This knowledge will aid in determining if the shaft needs to be stiffer or more flexible in the butt, (41", 36") mid, ( 31", 26", 21") and tip (11", 16") sections.

    Quote Originally Posted by mcgoo
    My best club (accuracy & consistancy), an old Powerbuilt 5 wood, has an old True Temper graphite shaft without a flex specification, kicks in the middle of the shaft more than the tip.
    It is good that this shaft works for you but remember, it is a 5 wood club, not a driver and infinitely easier to hit, regardless of the shaft. The bolded part IS irrational and is based on what you feel, which is not necessarily reliable. (a) the shaft does not KICK, it bends. The difference between a high "kick" and a "low" kick is about an inch, max, is no where near the tip, so it did NOT kick, inspite of what you felt. (b) A shaft bends as you start the downswing and does NOT unbend in the same plane through impact. In fact, it rotates about 90*while bending and the club head and your hands are actually closer to the target at impact than the point of maximum bending of the shaft.

    Quote Originally Posted by mcgoo
    I want to shaft the TM 3U to make it perform like a 3 iron (which I cannot hit) by being able to swing it as if I am swinging a fairway wood and get the accuracy of an iron. All this while using a slow backswing and a scoup downswing.
    What is a scoup downswing? All other things being equal, what is it about the 3U that makes it easier to hit than a 3 iron? More loft? Roll? Buldge? Shorter shaft? More flexible shaft? Regardless, your swing should be the same with all clubs, from driver to wedge.

    Jump all over me for this, but my perception is that you believe that the "right" club, will actually seriously compensate for swing flaws. IMO, if golfers were to spend more time thinking about their swings and less on the micro analysis of the parameters of golf shafts,(an interesting hobby, BTW) they would be better players.
    Last edited by BC MIST; 06-27-2006 at 04:47 PM.

  9. #9
    Must be Single 1972Apex is on a distinguished road 1972Apex's Avatar
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    So Terrance, are you suitably confused yet? LOL!

  10. #10
    I Just Won't Leave covanant is on a distinguished road covanant's Avatar
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    Oh man,here we go again
    Who let the techies out?lol,the guru's have spoken
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  11. #11
    Postaholic mcgoo is on a distinguished road
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    Thanks Chieflongtee and BC Mist for your help. Reid, I am not confused my solution is now crystal clear; learn to swing better. However, before doing so I want to get the right club to do it.

    The wonderful article (response) on the subject by BC Mist deserves to be studiously digested and responded to, which I cannot do at the moment because of an appointment. I will respond this evening.
    Last edited by mcgoo; 06-27-2006 at 08:23 PM.

  12. #12
    Arrow shooter Chieflongtee is on a distinguished road Chieflongtee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reid Masson
    So Terrance, are you suitably confused yet? LOL!
    Rainy day.
    Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.
    Mahatma Gandhi

  13. #13
    Postaholic mcgoo is on a distinguished road
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    Covanant , Enjoy!

  14. #14
    Arrow shooter Chieflongtee is on a distinguished road Chieflongtee's Avatar
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    BTW Reid,Geoff and Saint use the trial and error method
    Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.
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  15. #15
    Postaholic mcgoo is on a distinguished road
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    BC Mist:

    As usual, it is a pleasure to read your analysis. I enjoy the detail you bring to technical discussions; few take the time these days to do so.
    And I appreciate your providing me with information that I do not possess.

    Regarding the physiology of golfers and their choices in equipment we may be on equal ground. Are those of us who are too busy, too old, too weak, too incompetent, too lazy or too impatient to learn the proper golf swing doomed? No; thanks to the equipment makers. If we all had the same proper swing we would only need one set of perfect clubs. Clubs would be a commodity and experts like you would be superfluous.

    More seriously, I do not understand “(41", 36") mid, ( 31", 26", 21") and tip (11", 16") sections”. I can understand that the characteristics of the swing are important (downhillslider does not think the back swing is very important, quote “it doesn’t matter how you get it up”. I am older and have to work on that.

    Is not the difference between “kick and “bend” one of semantics? Does the industry not write “kick” on many shafts as in mid-kick? Should it be mid-bend. Scoup is like pushing snow, while banging down with an iron is like shovelling. I push woods and utilities and bang down with irons.


    The TM 3U is really a wide cavity back iron to help get the ball up, with a huge offset to reduce slicing. It is not sold in North America. Here is the TM Japanese site for the club if your Japanese is up scratch. It has a picture and deminsions of the clubhead.

    http://www.taylormadegolf.com/japan/products/irons/rac_irons/p_i_rac_Cgb_Utility.asp

    Downhillslider has kindly offered to put in an older True Temper A flex graphite .370 pull, made for a brand name club maker, as a test. This is Chieflongtee”s “Trail & Error” solution to my predicament of looking for a solution; to not being able to get a three iron sufficiently up in the air without slicing. You tell me to learn how to swing properly. I promise to do so if you tell me what shaft to use with this TM 3U head.

    All this is the fault of Big Easy for not keeping the club.
    Maybe this thread should be moved to Components & Tools or Clubmakers
    Last edited by mcgoo; 06-27-2006 at 08:19 PM.

  16. #16
    Must be Single 1972Apex is on a distinguished road 1972Apex's Avatar
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    Consider it moved . I left a redirect in the Want to Buy section.
    Andre LOL at your point about 'rainy day' and also the 'trial and error' methods. So very true!
    It's still raining here guys so have at it!

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