New Irons

[golfdoc]

Just a heads up for those of you looking for new irons.

If you are someone who doesn't ever hit a 3 iron or a 4 iron, then there is a set of clubs for you.

Adams is coming out with a mixed set. It iwll comprise of 2 utility woods and 5iron to PW.

I currently use the Adams 18 degree and 21 degree I-woods, or utility woods and love them. They are easy to hit and have eliminated my 3 and 4 irons.

http://www.edwinwatts.com/AB1936000/...roduct_ID=3960

Take a look and see. These look great.

I am a 5 handicap and never hit 3 or 4 irons. Instead of trying to put together a mix-match set of clubs, now I can buy a proper set, with matching swing weights, shafts, grips etc...

[jimrobin]

I've been looking at sets that are different throughout. I often wondered, every club hits the ball different distances and trajectory, why have clubs all with the same design. Lately some manufactures have been coming out with a progression of forgiveness to feel within a set of clubs. They also have a reduced offset, as the irons get higher in loft. From cavity backs for forgiveness (long irons) to muscle backs for control (mid irons) to blades for play & workability (short irons & wedges).
i.e.
Maxfli's A10's
http://www.golfdiscount.com/Detail.bok?id=427

Nike Pro Combo
http://nikegolf.nike.com/nikegolf/clubs/index.shtml

This is the first time I have seen utility woods within the set though. I like this idea for amateurs that have trouble hitting long irons. I've been told Taylor Made is coming out with a set similar also, and I imagine probably all the manufactures will be.

Does anybody have any feedback on this type of set? How do you like them?

[golfdoc]

As I mentioned, I play the Adams i-woods along with Titleist driver and 3 wood. I have eliminated my 3&4 irons.

Ican't hit long irons. I will hit my 5 iron 175-185 max. The i-woods are great off the fairway and off the tee.

Years ago, I owned a set of Callaway blades and was great with the 8,9 & PW but couldn't hit long or mid iron blades to save my life.

Now it seems golf club manufacturers undestand this.

I need control with short irons, forgiveness with mid-irons and help with long irons.

[Kilroy]

Any custom clubmaker can do this. I play a set of clubs from Swing Sync:

Driver - KZG Miraging "oversized" 9 deg
Woods - KZG low profile "B- Marageing" heads and FiberX shafts. 1,3,5,7 & 9
Irons - KZG Forged heads and SK Fiber SL40 shafts. 3,4,5,6,7,8,9,P,M,S
Wedges - Cleveland 588 RTG (rusty) wedges 49,53,56, and 60 degree.

20 sticks in all, 16 frequency matched clubs and 4 588s which are not matched to the KZGs, but I prefer the heavier weighting and the feel of my 588s to the KZG ones.
They all have Lamkin half-chord grips, which I love.

In the bag I usually carry:
Driver KZG 9 deg oversized
Woods 3 5 7 9 KZK low profile
Irons 6 7 8 9 KZG forged
Wedges 49 53 56 60 Cleveland

On very windy days I swap the 7 & 9 woods for 4 & 5 irons

[golfdoc]

Yes, custom clubmakers can do the same. They can offer all sorts of combos to suit your game.

In my opinion, the "brand name" clubs are better. I have hit many different knock-off designs with high end shafts in them. They aren't the same.

Performance is not the same. Yes they look similar. Yes you can try them with identical shafts but they don't compare. Irons are a little closer in comparison but woods are not. especially drivers.

The Maxfli A10's are not that easy to play. I tried them last year and the long irons were still tough to hit.

[Kilroy]

I do not think that KZG are knock offs, although the fairway woods are similar to the Adams, and I believe the actual manufacturer is the same, they are not copies.

The irons are not similar to anything I have seen. They were not sold as "just like" anything.

There are some excellent products out there that don't have a big name, and many times a single manufacturer sells components to many labels. It is very hard to be sure who made what in who's factory.

You are correct in saying that knock offs are not the same as the clubs they mimic. I would be very skeptical of such claims. I would not recommend knock offs to anyone.

[Chieflongtee]

Originally posted by Dan Kilbank
I do not think that KZG are knock offs, although the fairway woods are similar to the Adams, and I believe the actual manufacturer is the same, they are not copies.

The irons are not similar to anything I have seen. They were not sold as "just like" anything.

There are some excellent products out there that don't have a big name, and many times a single manufacturer sells components to many labels. It is very hard to be sure who made what in who's factory.

You are correct in saying that knock offs are not the same as the clubs they mimic. I would be very skeptical of such claims. I would not recommend knock offs to anyone.

I have a question. If you are not having any degree of success with the 3&4 irons and your handicap is 5 which is excellent I am wondering what kind of results you're getting with the driver. As you know a 9 degree driver is not as forgiving as a 12 degree or a 3 wood. I was always led to believe that if you can swing a driver consistently you can swing any clubs in the bag. We all want to lower our handicap but sometimes we let our ego get in the way. In my case If I were to drop the 3 iron I would feel like my swing needs work. I have to admit though that the 3&4 irons are somewhat similar to a box of Cracker Jack never knowing what kind of asurprise I am going to get. A.C.

[el tigre]

[el tigre]

[el tigre]

Originally posted by Andre Cantin
I was always led to believe that if you can swing a driver consistently you can swing any clubs in the bag.

.. ahhh, if the game was only as simple as learning to swing a driver consistently!

First of all, swinging an iron and swinging a wood are not the same. Many people think there SHOULD NOT be a difference, but there is. I have seen too many golfers who can hit irons well but not fairway woods (and vice versa) to know that to compare hitting a driver with hitting a 3-iron makes no sense at all. On some days, I hit the driver better than I am hitting a pitching wedge - but that's just me!

Secondly, driving the ball is only one quarter of the game - and the least important one at that! Proficiency at approach shots, short game and putting is more important to lowering your handicap.

BTW, if you want fewer surprises you should try hitting a 7-wood. Personally, I can hit a 7-wood much better than a 3-iron for the same distance - regardless of how well I'm hitting the other clubs in my bag. It doesn't work that way for everyone, but it might work for you.

[Kilroy]

I am not the 5 hcp, that was golfdoc.
I am an 18 and I will hit driver perhaps 5 times per round. I have a bit of a fade, and the occasional pull. I only use driver when I have a wide enough fairway that I can do one or the other and survive. Other than that, I hit 3W off the tee. (My 3W is 13 deg)
I definately hit the 7 and 9w better than the 3 and 5 I no doubt about it. The short woods are very high flying, so that's why I swap them for the long irons on windy days.

[Chieflongtee]

Originally posted by Dan Kilbank
I am not the 5 hcp, that was golfdoc.
I am an 18 and I will hit driver perhaps 5 times per round. I have a bit of a fade, and the occasional pull. I only use driver when I have a wide enough fairway that I can do one or the other and survive. Other than that, I hit 3W off the tee. (My 3W is 13 deg)
I definately hit the 7 and 9w better than the 3 and 5 I no doubt about it. The short woods are very high flying, so that's why I swap them for the long irons on windy days.

El tigre. It is my opinion thet if you hit the 3/4 irons poorly you and I have swing flaws. Usually if you don't hit those well you will slice hook push pull your driver. Maybe not as much anymore because of huge heads but not consistently pretty straight. True the driver is only part of the equation but I would rather come in with a 9 a pitch or a sand wedge than let's say a 5 on down. The reason is that if I pull/push a 9 on up slightly I will still end up un the green or pretty close. Nobody likes to play catch up golf and unless you're playing on wide courses you don't want to spend the whole round chipping out or trying to voluntarily hit draws and fades to get in good position. Indeed we should spend a lifetime practicing sand shots chipping and putting because that's where the scoring takes place but a good drive will help you get there in regulation. As far as the 7 and 9 wood the reason they are more forgiving is because of the loft. As we all know the more loft the more backspin and the less sidespin. 3 iron loft=21 degrees 4iron loft=24 degrees 7wood=23 degrees 9wood=26 degrees which means a fade becomes a slight push etc. Have a great day. A.C.

[golfdoc]

I am the 5 handicap.
I hit my driver a lot and hit it well.
Average distance is probably 250.

Andre

You need a lot of strength to hit 3 and 4 irons. With my short irons, I am very controlled and know my yardages well.

I can hit a 3 and 4 iron off a tee with some consistency but lack distance. I can't hit them off the fairway.

I have a very short takeaway with very good tempo. I very rarely get the club to parallel, which means less distance on long irons. On short irons it doesn't matter.

Swinging a driver is easy IF you swing easy. I have worked on my swing indoors for the last few winters and increased my clubhead speed but only to 100 MPH at the most.

I don't play oversized irons so the 3 and 4 are very small. The sweet spot is tiny.

I admit my swing is not perfect but I wouldn't say that I have swing flaws. I have a fairly short compact swing that is very reliable.

If you've played the Dome you'll understand this. I hit driver on all par 5's and all par 4's except one on some occasions. I am accurate with my driver. I don't have the strength to hit 3 and 4 irons.

[Chieflongtee]

Originally posted by golfdoc
I am the 5 handicap.
I hit my driver a lot and hit it well.
Average distance is probably 250.

Andre

You need a lot of strength to hit 3 and 4 irons. With my short irons, I am very controlled and know my yardages well.

I can hit a 3 and 4 iron off a tee with some consistency but lack distance. I can't hit them off the fairway.

I have a very short takeaway with very good tempo. I very rarely get the club to parallel, which means less distance on long irons. On short irons it doesn't matter.

Swinging a driver is easy IF you swing easy. I have worked on my swing indoors for the last few winters and increased my clubhead speed but only to 100 MPH at the most.

Golfdoc.
I hit the 3 and 4 iron solidly but can't predict the outcome i.e pull or push. I even thought of buying heel weighted irons. I am sure you've heard of those. The weight is moved progressively from the heel towards the middle as you go up in the set. The builders claim that these type of irons help you square the club face more easily and that it reduces the tendency of pushing the ball. I also considered the TRI-Gold shafts from from true temper. Apparently these shafts are softer in the long irons and stiffer in the short irons which basically will accomplish the same results as the heel weighted irons. I read one of your post in the instruction section about high fades. Can I ask what kind of shafts you play with? A high bend point shaft will lower the trajectory. I play with offset and slightly closed faced woods and I find they help reducing the fades. Take care. A.C.


I don't play oversized irons so the 3 and 4 are very small. The sweet spot is tiny.

I admit my swing is not perfect but I wouldn't say that I have swing flaws. I have a fairly short compact swing that is very reliable.

If you've played the Dome you'll understand this. I hit driver on all par 5's and all par 4's except one on some occasions. I am accurate with my driver. I don't have the strength to hit 3 and 4 irons.

[golfdoc]

Andre

When it comes to high fades, I know what the problem is. I tend to slide through the ball and my hands get stuck behind. My hips open early and the ball fades weakly to the right.

In terms of offset irons and closed face woods...
You are simply compensating for a problem in your swing. I never recommend them to anybody. I recommend fixing your swing. What happens if you suddenly start hitting hooks and pulls on all your shots. Will you go buy new clubs again to fix the problem?

Just curious...

[jimrobin]

Ask any pro, the two outcomes of majority errors for a right-handed golfer is either short right or long left of your target. I've heard quite often, even PGA golfers look at those 2 spots and it is that, which decides whether they go at a pin or to a safe area on the green. If they are to error, that is likely where the ball will end up, so they look and see if there is any trouble in those locations if they go at the pin.

Obviously, short-right they probably didn’t get their hands thru in time and they did a weak fade, long-left means they came over the top a little and pulled the ball.

If you end up short-left or long-right, you probably didn't have the right club in your hands.

[Chieflongtee]

Originally posted by golfdoc
Andre

When it comes to high fades, I know what the problem is. I tend to slide through the ball and my hands get stuck behind. My hips open early and the ball fades weakly to the right.

In terms of offset irons and closed face woods...
You are simply compensating for a problem in your swing. I never recommend them to anybody. I recommend fixing your swing. What happens if you suddenly start hitting hooks and pulls on all your shots. Will you go buy new clubs again to fix the problem?

Just curious...

Golfdoc
If I were to pull and hook all my shots at least I could predict the outcome and aim accordingly that is, aim right and bring it back. Jack Nicklaus made a career ou of aiming left because he was a fader and played the percentages. He would allow for his fade. If he hit it straight which he claims is an accident he would be on the left side of the fairway. If he got his usual fade he'd be down the middle and if he sliced a bit more than usual he'd end up on the right side but in all cases in the fairway. As far as offset woods and irons they work for me. They are game improvement clubs. Remember when hockey sticks were straight. Should the cavity back irons and lob wedge be banned? Not that I don't have the inclination to perfect my swing and by the way 5 is a great handicap but I simply do not have the time presently to Nick Faldo my swing. My driver , 3 wood and 5 wood are all offset. A lot of irons out there are offset and some guys don't even know that they are playing offset irons. One thing for sure I hate going right and these clubs help me reduce that tendency. This past summer I was in the driving range hitting mostly pretty good drives with a slight draw when I borrowed a Taylor made steel series from the guy next to me. To my amazement all shots went right from the intended target. Needless to say I went back to my offset driver in a jiffy. I have sold to my playing partners offset woods that I put up and all of them were quite pleased. The stubborn ones and none believers are still out there looking for their balls in the Amazonian forest to the right. Signed: Found 2 million balls in the forest. 3 on the left and the rest guess.A.c.

[The Shtick]

Custom fitted clubs are the way to go.

[Chieflongtee]

Originally posted by The Shtick
Custom fitted clubs are the way to go.

The fact is that some people have to have brand names and you'll never be able to counter that. The truth is that most pros have their clubs tweaked in more ways than one. Oftentimes a 4iron has the loft of a 3 iron and so forth. In other words the pros have O.E.M customized. But what you buy off the rack is not what the pros play with. Marketing, endorsements... you know. End of replies on that topic. A.C.