Hogan/Dunnigan/Tiger

[Powerdraw]

yes that is right, i was just talking about the drill trying to keep something tight throughout the stroke. As for the more in 2 out, how so? pp4 is not directionnal in my opinion, the right shoulder thrust would be more of a directional factor, the left arm i dont think does much in this case.

[mberube]

yes that is right, i was just talking about the drill trying to keep something tight throughout the stroke. As for the more in 2 out, how so? pp4 is not directionnal in my opinion, the right shoulder thrust would be more of a directional factor, the left arm i dont think does much in this case.

I think your left arm has everything to do with swing path. If your left arm disconnects from your body you will probably cross the target line resulting in an in2out swing creating a push or a right to left hook.

At least it’s my understanding of the swing.

[BC MIST]

yes that is right, i was just talking about the drill trying to keep something tight throughout the stroke. As for the more in 2 out, how so? pp4 is not directionnal in my opinion, the right shoulder thrust would be more of a directional factor, the left arm i dont think does much in this case.

yes that is right, i was just talking about the drill trying to keep something tight throughout the stroke. As for the more in 2 out, how so? pp4 is not directionnal in my opinion, the right shoulder thrust would be more of a directional factor, the left arm i dont think does much in this case.

Aha! A discussion with some meat in it. May I offer my take on the recent comments?

If the left upper arm separates from the chest through impact (pp4), the arms will go more down the line, which is NOT desireable, the club will be off plane to the right so a pushed type shot will result, depending on face position and power will be LOST.

IMO, when the hands "stop" going forward, inertia will very quickly cause the right arm power package to straighten, resulting in maximum velocity. If the left are separates, the hands do not "stop" or they slow down less, and the right arm package will not straighten as fast. Compare it to striking a 5' stick against a tree 1' from the hands. When the stick by your hands stops dead, the stick at the 5' end keeps going and the stick will snap. But if you hit the stick with the same force against something soft and more absorbant, the stick may not break.

Having the left upper arm on the chest aids in the on plane release of the right arm and if allowed to wing away, forces the club to swing the OUT of the inside/out swing path, which is NOT desireable. What we want is an inside/inside path, where the head does NOT cross the line. To keep ON PLANE, the hands must come more around the body, not down the line.

Look at this shot of Hogan. The delayed release is obvious, the right hand is still bent, the arms are approaching the true release point which occurs well after the ball has gone, but most importantly, look at his left upper arm. It is still tight to the chest. I have another shot of Hogan in a similar position, but from the down the line view, where his hands have come around the body and do NOT go down the line which would happen with separation. The left arm is kept on the chest until the hands are about hip high in the through swing, where separation occurs.

Having trouble uploading pic. Will add this later, if possible.

[Powerdraw]

i agree and have seen those pics before...the blastoff of chest should be well into the followthrough and not impact indeed...can you say chinese drum?

[mberube]

I’m back after a couple of weeks of thinking and trying.

First thing I didn’t like on my original video was that my hands and shaft were a lot higher and steeper at impact compared to my setup. The goal is to come back at the same spot at impac as I was at address just like the Pro pics on page one of this thread.

I took a piece of 2x10, a 4x4 and 3/8 plastic plumbing tubes. As you will see in the attached pics, the tubing comes close to my hands at address. The tubes are in a T shape so there is a piece that is parallel to the target line.

This tool gives me no other chose but to come back where I started at impact. I crouch a lot more but I will work on that. It was and still is difficult to hit the ball on the sweet-spot but I gather that It’s cause of the swing change.

This tool could also help the over the top swinger. It would be impossible to swing OTT and make contact on the ball with this tool.

Comments are welcome.

Mike

[Started2k3]

I’m back after a couple of weeks of thinking and trying.

First thing I didn’t like on my original video was that my hands and shaft were a lot higher and steeper at impact compared to my setup. The goal is to come back at the same spot at impac as I was at address just like the Pro pics on page one of this
...

This tool gives me no other chose but to come back where I started at impact. I crouch a lot more but I will work on that. It was and still is difficult to hit the ball on the sweet-spot but I gather that It’s cause of the swing change.

This tool could also help the over the top swinger. It would be impossible to swing OTT and make contact on the ball with this tool.

Comments are welcome.

Mike

I am reposting the Chad Cambell pics with lines. It appears that when BC put in the lines the first time he started off based on the shaft, then switched to the ball. This means that the lines have moved signficantly.

I have redrawn the lines but have used static background points to ensure that the lines dont move.

Note that Chad does NOT get back to the exact shaft line at impact. However, he is parallel to the shaft line at impact.

[Powerdraw]

your intentions are great. another way of practicing correctly as well is with a club liying on top of a bucket of ball extended out over your target line so you swing 'under' that club as well. i like your prop btw...but many pros and weekend warriors dont go back too oriignal shaft plane perfectly, mostly because of the uncocking of wrist and or coming in too high with right forearm not inline with shaft at impact what the better players strive for. The pros do it better than us, what can i say!

[mberube]

your intentions are great. another way of practicing correctly as well is with a club liying on top of a bucket of ball extended out over your target line so you swing 'under' that club as well. i like your prop btw...but many pros and weekend warriors dont go back too oriignal shaft plane perfectly, mostly because of the uncocking of wrist and or coming in too high with right forearm not inline with shaft at impact what the better players strive for. The pros do it better than us, what can i say!

The “Club lying on a bucket” drill is for the OOT swinger. That’s not what I am trying to fix. My prop is to get my hands back on plane, not the club head.

I understand that some pros and most amateurs don’t come back on line but most great ball strikers do. Never the less my swing tool has made an immense change for the better at the impact position.

Mike

[Powerdraw]

i really like your prop for the hands, can you make me one to glide on too the top and back down? now THAT would be amazing.

do you have a reference point for your hands at setup? i mean reference too the ground? feet? my thinking is say hands over left toe, you start them there visually and try and get them back there visually, instead of just missing the prop,

how do you go about it?

[BC MIST]

I admire your persistence. When you make up your mind to do something to better your swing, it seems nothing will stand in your way. Your prop is obviously working as you are getting into a better position coming down. I caught a glimpse of one similar to yours on the Golf Channel last week. Too bad you you didn't get a patent.

[Powerdraw]

hey BC, i have a full planeboard i built out of cardboard that can be taken apart into 4 quadrants wich finishes at 36 x 36 x 8inches...hows that. now find me some funds to bring it to the golfing world! lol

[BC MIST]

hey BC, i have a full planeboard i built out of cardboard that can be taken apart into 4 quadrants wich finishes at 36 x 36 x 8inches...hows that. now find me some funds to bring it to the golfing world! lol

If the shares of Tim Horton's I bought Friday go to $100, I may be in touch. With your idea and my backing, we will split the profits 1:10, OK?

[Powerdraw]

30-70.....at 1-10, you must be ahitter....lol

[mberube]

I admire your persistence. When you make up your mind to do something to better your swing, it seems nothing will stand in your way. Your prop is obviously working as you are getting into a better position coming down. I caught a glimpse of one similar to yours on the Golf Channel last week. Too bad you you didn't get a patent.

Thanks for the complement Lyle. I personally think that props are the best an efficient way to change your swing. Why? Cause you don’t have to think when you swing. You just have to swing within the props limitation. It’s awkward but eventually it becomes natural and that, you can take to the course.

I still haven’t figured out a prop to flatten my downswing but I’m getting there. Also this prop has flattened it a but.

Powerdraw, if I understand correctly, you want pics of my prop from different angles? Is that right?
As for a reference point, I don’t have any. My setup is solid and I don’t intend to change it. What you see is my original setup. I just adjusted the tubing so that it comes as close to my hands as possible without being feeling crowded.

Mike

[Powerdraw]

no pics of props, i was wondering when you look down and see your hands and the prop, do you use a visual reference point looking down to make sure you will miss the prop on the way down?

Oh BC, how can he flatten his desired downswing in your opinion?

[Powerdraw]

oh mberube, what do you use for backing in your garage for your practice? im drawing my house and of course have planned a golf boyz room space and was wondering...im an architect so imagine the fun im having planning this....but i need something that will cushion the blow, any ideas?

[mberube]

no pics of props, i was wondering when you look down and see your hands and the prop, do you use a visual reference point looking down to make sure you will miss the prop on the way down?

Oh BC, how can he flatten his desired downswing in your opinion?

No reference point. I setup normally and adjusted the prop so that it is about 3 inches from my hands as you can se here.

[mberube]

oh mberube, what do you use for backing in your garage for your practice? im drawing my house and of course have planned a golf boyz room space and was wondering...im an architect so imagine the fun im having planning this....but i need something that will cushion the blow, any ideas?

I use a painter’s tarp. You can get them at Home Depot or any other competitors. I have tried a lot of different things and nothing it strong enough. I have used this for the past year and it very strong. All the other material I have tried did not hold up. The ball would eventually tear it up in no time.

A P3pro simulator is a must if you build a golf room.

Mike

[Powerdraw]

a P3pro? what is that?
just the painters tarp? nothing behind it? im glad i asked! i guess you dont sky to many shots or did you tarp the cieling? hehe

[mberube]

a P3pro? what is that?

http://www.p3proswing.com/
A must have.

just the painters tarp? nothing behind it? im glad i asked! i guess you dont sky to many shots or did you tarp the cieling? hehe

The tarp is attached to the ceiling and drops down like a drape. The tarp is about 2 feet from the back wall. I stand fairly close to the tarp witch would make it very difficult to sky the ball on the ceiling. I hit lob web without coming close to the ceiling.

[Powerdraw]

i took a look at the site for the p3pro, it seems awesome! wich one did you get? just the basic sensor? is it cool? worth it?

[mberube]

i took a look at the site for the p3pro, it seems awesome! wich one did you get? just the basic sensor? is it cool? worth it?

I got the mat, the sensor unit and the Tiger Woods plug-in. Everything is amazingly fun and useful accept the TW game add-on. It only reads your swing speed with the TW game. You can’t hit hooks or slices. The ball always goes straight.

When you practice with the P3PRO software or play a game on their course it’s very realistic. A lot more realistic then Golf-O-Max.

No regrets at all in fact I highly recommend it if you have the space.

Mike