red stakes

[NoBack]

Gary

When you hit into red staked hazard, are you alllowed to drop without keeping the flag in line with point of entry?

If so? When?

[Gary Hill]

I use a simple 3-5 technic for remembering the options for water hazards.

3 Options from a water hazard (yellow stakes).

1. Play the ball where it is.
2. Replay from where is was.
3. Take relief straight back away from the hole.

5 Options from a later water hazard (red stakes).

1. Same as above
2. Same as above
3. Same as above
4. Two clubs lengths from where it entered.
5. Two club lengths on the other side of the hazard.

The technical details of the relief procedures may be found in this thread. Halfway down in reply to Colby

Let me know if you need a further explanation.

[NoBack]

Gary

That is by far the easiest answer you have given on a rule. No technical explanation needed, as they only confuse things more.

I have been playing with the assumption that I could bring it out as you say, but I also was under the impression that I HAD to keep the flag in line with point of entry. So this good to know!

Dan, you are da man!

[St Andrew]

What if the red stakes are only set up on one side of a creek. Can you still drop on the other side? How would you measure?

[spidey]

Yes you can drop on the other side of the creek, however, if there are no stakes on the other side, it's likely that it's out of bounds.

If there are no stakes, then it's reasonable to assume that the margin of the hazard is where the water normally would be. It is unlikely that the committee would not ensure that the margin of the hazard is marked.

If you are dropping on the other side of the lateral hazard, your drop area is a place equidistant from the hole to the spot where the ball last crossed the margin of the hazard. Your drop must be outside the hazard.

btw... your drop area is two club lengths from the entry point not nearer the hole, NOT two club lengths from the nearest point of relief.

[St Andrew]

I was thinking of 17 at Champlain, the creek on the right has red stakes, and according to this, you could drop on the other side of the creek with a clear shot to the green, but I am not sure if there are stakes on the other side and if 2 club lengths would get you out from under the trees. I'll have to look when I go back. I doubt the other side is out of bounds.

[spidey]

Don't think I know which hole this is... last time I played Champlain.. it seems to me that 17 had OB on the right... I guess that was about 18 or so years ago....

Just looked at the website... aha... 17 is where number 8 used to be, and what I remember as 17 is now number 3.

If there is no way to get across the lateral hazard, then it's no good to you. Usually, hazards are marked lateral for this very reason, so that you don't have to find a boat to get across to play from the other side.

[Gary Hill]

quoted by spidey: if there are no stakes on the other side, it's likely that it's out of bounds

False. When a body of water forms part of the boundary of a course, it should be defined as either a lateral water hazard or as out of bounds. It cannot be both.

quoted by spidey: If there is no way to get across the lateral hazard, then it's no good to you. Usually, hazards are marked lateral for this very reason

False. A lateral water hazard is a water hazard so situated that is it impossible to drop a ball behind water hazard.
The fact that you may or may not be able to get to the other side is irrelevant.

In the case of hole 17 at Champlain, the pro shop tells me that the side away from the fairway is not marked.
In a case where the margin of a hazard is not marked, the margin of the hazard is deemed to be the natural margin of the hazard.
This is, generally speaking, where the ground breaks down to form the depression containing the water.