Match play handicap confusion

Example
White tees 70.0/118
Red tees 65.0/ 106
Two men with 7 hdcps are playing a match. One has only ever played from the reds and the other only ever played from the whites.
My understanding for their match the calculation is: 70.0-65.0=5
So the player from the red must give the player from the white 5 strokes.
Now when I look at the Golf Canada website I see course handicap and both players retain their 7 handicaps from either tee.
So now I'm confused.
The 7 hdcp from the white will in my opinion beat the 7 hdcp from the reds almost all the time if he is given 5 strokes.
So do they play straight up or does the player from the whites get 5 strokes added to then handicap?

You are mixing up terms, which is why you are confused.

When you enter your scores, you receive what is called a "handicap factor". This is a number with a decimal in it, for example 7.0. Your handicap factor is calculated based on your score and the slope and rating of the courses you play. Now, when you play a specific set of tees, your handicap factor is used to calculate a "course handicap" for the tees you are playing. This number has no decimal place. If you are playing a match from the same set of tees, then you use the calculated course handicaps as is. If you are playing from different tees then you need to adjust the course handicaps by the difference in the ratings.

So, in your example, it is perfectly normal for one player to have handicap factor of 7.0 from the only every playing from the red and different player to have a handicap factor of 7.0 from the white. Note again, that a handicap factor != course handicap.

Using the number you provided, if you have a handicap factor of 7.0 your course handicap from the white would be close to 7 but from the red it would probably be about a 6 or maybe a 5, I haven't done the math.

The handicap system is supposed to account for differences in length, hazards, etc, but it's not perfect. It's possible that if you only played the reds you would have a handicap factor of say 6.0, but if you only played the whites you'd have a handicap factor of 9.5.

Assuming you meant that they both had a handicap factor of 7.0, the math works out as follows: The white player calculates his course handicap as 7.0 X 118/113 = 7.3, which rounds to 7. For the red player its 7.0 X 106/113 = 6.6, which also rounds to 7. With the differance in course rating, the red player has to give 5 strokes.

If they both had handicap factors of 14.0, the course handicap for the white is 14.6 which rounds to 15 while the red is 13.1, rounding to 13. The the red player would have to give up 2 for the differance in course handicap plus the 5, for a total of 7.

Since it's a match, the red player plays without any strokes on any holes, and the white gets his 5 strokes (or 7 in the second example) on handicap holes 1 - 5 (or 1-7).

I really think there is a lot of confusion here and I think that may be coming from the wording of the OP.
When the original poster wrote that two players both had a "handicap" of 7 I am assuming they meant that the two players had a "factor" of 7.0 with Golf Canada.
If they both have a Factor of 7.0 then they would play a match play match straight up whatever tees they played from whether it be tips, middle or front.
However to ACHIEVE that factor of 7.0 in the first place the player who only played from the Reds is probably scoring 4-5 strokes per round better than the player only playing from the whites. In calculating each players factor the Golf Canada handicapping system factors in the slope and rating.
Remember your Factor is what you take with you wherever you go...your handicap only applies to a specific tee block on a specific course.
In short, if they both have a factor of 7.0 they play straight up regardless of which course or tee blocks they achieved that factor from :)

Martin B I think you are mistaken on how a course handicap is calculated. If two players have a factor of 7.0 how they achieved that factor is irrelevant. You calculate their course handicap by applying their factor to the slope/rating of the tee blocks they are going to play that day.
In the example you give if they played each other from the reds they would both have a course handicap of 6.6, from the whites 7.3 and so on. In other words they play straight up.

Of course, if they both have the same handicap index and both play from the same tees, they play even.

I took the question to be how the handicaps are effected if each plays from his favourite tees - i.e. the match is played with one playing off the whites and the other from the reds. (More likely with a man and woman playing, but men are not required to play the same tees.)

Ah yes...I think I was the one confused lol.
Of course in that example red would have to give white 5 strokes exactly as you said...apologies :)

Lets assume that both have a factor of 7.0.
if one wants to play from red while the other plays from white, can you explain why they would give up 5 strokes? Wouldn't they each get a course handicap based on the slope of the tees they are playing? meaning the 6.6 for the guy playing red, and 7.3 for the guy playing white?
so no strokes given.
can someone clarify when you use the course rating in a match?

Handicap factors are calculated starting from the course rating.

Since the course rating is already factored into your handicap factor, the course handicap calculation does not use the rating. It is simply based off of the slope of the tees you are playing. However, that only works if you are playing the same tees.

When you use different tees then you have to account for the differences in the course rating.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by g8r

Lets assume that both have a factor of 7.0.
if one wants to play from red while the other plays from white, can you explain why they would give up 5 strokes? Wouldn't they each get a course handicap based on the slope of the tees they are playing? meaning the 6.6 for the guy playing red, and 7.3 for the guy playing white?
so no strokes given.
can someone clarify when you use the course rating in a match?

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You would only use the course rating in a match if the players are playing from different tees as mentioned above. For more information:

http://www.usga.org/HandicapFAQ/hand...r.asp?FAQidx=6

This answers the exact question the OP had.

So if I'm understanding this:

Player A 6.7
Player B 10.0
Player C 12.2
Player D 15.2

Players A and B playing from Blue tees: 70.2/117, Players C and D playing from White tees: 67.7/112

Player A course handicap is 6.9 (7), B is 10.4 (10), C is 12.1 (12), D is 15.1 (15) (I will round to make it easier to understand)

So difference in tees is 70.2-67.7=2.5 (round to 3 for ease of use)

So A plays to scratch, B gets 3 strokes, C gets 2 strokes (12-7=5-3 (difference in tees)), D gets 5 strokes (15-7=8-3 (difference in tees).

Am I correct?

That sounds right.

Much simpler to just have them play from the same tees though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Big Johnny69

So if I'm understanding this:

Player A 6.7
Player B 10.0
Player C 12.2
Player D 15.2

Players A and B playing from Blue tees: 70.2/117, Players C and D playing from White tees: 67.7/112

Player A course handicap is 6.9 (7), B is 10.4 (10), C is 12.1 (12), D is 15.1 (15) (I will round to make it easier to understand)

So difference in tees is 70.2-67.7=2.5 (round to 3 for ease of use)

So A plays to scratch, B gets 3 strokes, C gets 2 strokes (12-7=5-3 (difference in tees)), D gets 5 strokes (15-7=8-3 (difference in tees).

Am I correct?

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Looks good to me.